663
you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
view the rest of the comments
this post was submitted on 03 Jan 2024
663 points (94.7% liked)
politics
19241 readers
1814 users here now
Welcome to the discussion of US Politics!
Rules:
- Post only links to articles, Title must fairly describe link contents. If your title differs from the site’s, it should only be to add context or be more descriptive. Do not post entire articles in the body or in the comments.
Links must be to the original source, not an aggregator like Google Amp, MSN, or Yahoo.
Example:
- Articles must be relevant to politics. Links must be to quality and original content. Articles should be worth reading. Clickbait, stub articles, and rehosted or stolen content are not allowed. Check your source for Reliability and Bias here.
- Be civil, No violations of TOS. It’s OK to say the subject of an article is behaving like a (pejorative, pejorative). It’s NOT OK to say another USER is (pejorative). Strong language is fine, just not directed at other members. Engage in good-faith and with respect! This includes accusing another user of being a bot or paid actor. Trolling is uncivil and is grounds for removal and/or a community ban.
- No memes, trolling, or low-effort comments. Reposts, misinformation, off-topic, trolling, or offensive. Similarly, if you see posts along these lines, do not engage. Report them, block them, and live a happier life than they do. We see too many slapfights that boil down to "Mom! He's bugging me!" and "I'm not touching you!" Going forward, slapfights will result in removed comments and temp bans to cool off.
- Vote based on comment quality, not agreement. This community aims to foster discussion; please reward people for putting effort into articulating their viewpoint, even if you disagree with it.
- No hate speech, slurs, celebrating death, advocating violence, or abusive language. This will result in a ban. Usernames containing racist, or inappropriate slurs will be banned without warning
We ask that the users report any comment or post that violate the rules, to use critical thinking when reading, posting or commenting. Users that post off-topic spam, advocate violence, have multiple comments or posts removed, weaponize reports or violate the code of conduct will be banned.
All posts and comments will be reviewed on a case-by-case basis. This means that some content that violates the rules may be allowed, while other content that does not violate the rules may be removed. The moderators retain the right to remove any content and ban users.
That's all the rules!
Civic Links
• Congressional Awards Program
• Library of Congress Legislative Resources
• U.S. House of Representatives
Partnered Communities:
• News
founded 2 years ago
MODERATORS
Self solving problems are the best problems.
The problem is that there's people who have been vaccinated who aren't getting care because of the influx of idiots
I would also add that there's a cohort of the population who vaccines may not work on (hi, immunocompromised). Their protection relies on everyone around them getting vaccines to prevent the disease exposure in the first place.
Actions have consequences, and as we live in an interconnected society, sometimes your actions have consequences for others. Being an adult partially means taking responsibility and owning your part in the system.
That's a strategy that's used in IT all the time.
Like... We don't talk about that. Rule #1
Rule 1 is "the user always lies."
Well, most people just say, "Trust, but verify," but that's just semantics.
Vaccines are great for young people with strong immune systems. They are significantly less effective for the elderly and newborns and the immuno-compromised.
So if you get a nice thick herd immunity of healthy people surrounding the immune-weak, you can avoid sudden rampant disease spread into - say - retirement homes or daycares, which spike the incidence of illness for everyone. Also, keeping rates of spread low reduces the incidence of mutation and the chance for a given virus to evade the current vaccination protocol.
This isn't an individualist problem. Either we all immune together or we all get variants separately.
Less effective for the elderly compared to what? Staying unvaccinated? With diseases like COVID and flu the elderly are the group that should get vaccinated over nearly every other group.
"The data suggests that boosters and updated vaccines are more important for older adults. " source
Children are the second most important vaccination group after the elderly. Children represent the "high transmission" category. source
Well sure, because vaccines work by educating the immune system. Without a functioning one, a vaccine isn't going to help much, which is why the rest of us with otherwise healthy immune systems need to be vaccinated because they can't.
That doesn't work with highly mutagenic diseases because exposure to infection doesn't produce long standing immunity.
Compared to their younger counterparts. Older people have weaker immune systems. So prepping the immune system against a virus isn't as reliable. You can be vaxxed and still get sick. And even milder illnesses can have long-lasting effects.
Precisely because their immune systems are weaker. But at least as important as vaccinating the elderly is vaccinating the aid workers and family members in regular contact with them. An 8-year-old with the flu can absolutely deliver a death blow to an ailing vaccinated elderly relative. One of the leading causes of death in NYC, during the height of COVID, was sick nurses showing up for duty and passing the disease on to whole communities of elderly residents.
Because they're messy bitches more likely to fail at basic hygenie.
Yes. Exactly.
Highly mutagenic diseases are harder to vaccinate against, which is why we have annual flu shots and multiple flu shot variants. Also, why we can't vaccinate against the common cold.
Nevertheless, getting healthy people vaccinated when you can helps insulate people with weaker immune systems from coming into contact with the disease from the start, which improves the survival rate for everyone involved.
I think we are nearly in agreement with one another. Vaccination (of all kinds) is important for as many people as possible.
Absolutely. My concern is that it is often treated as an individualist problem (if you don't want to get sick then getting vaccinated is your responsibility) when disease spread is a more complex problem (vaccines have variable effects by individuals and exposure risks rise as fewer people are vaccinated).
Vaccination cannot be left to personal conviction. It has to come as a form of general public policy. And, as a result, it has to be publicly researched, funded, and distributed, rather than left to the whims of individuals.