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Why return-to-office mandates fail
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this post was submitted on 16 Jan 2024
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But if people don't go back to the office, commercial real estate will crash, they'll convert it all into affordable housing, and my curb appeal will lose its sweet, sweet premium value.
Let's not pretend there isn't a micromanaging control issue involved in this, but the core is all about real estate.
The "they'll convert it all into affordable housing" part I wouldn't be so sure about it. 😅 Some might just abandoned it if no body wants it.
Also, I really want malls to be turned into mixed use facilities. Like all the small stores are apartments and the big anchoring spaces on the ends of the mall would be grocery stores and shopping. Imagine you forgot to pick up milk after work so you just walk to the other end of the mall and buy it. I love that idea.
It would be perfect for assisted living facilities or care home situations where accessibility is key
The old folks are already there every morning walking around, just set them up with some recliners by the water fountain and Wii tennis.
And gyms!
This. I work in commercial real estate and it’s kind of hard to turn into house. It’s cheaper for them to just knock it down and start over.
The issue is the electricity and plumbing. In a commercial building these tend to run up and down the middle or just one side of the building. Apartments need to equally have access to utilities so they’d had to do a ton of construction to move plumbing and wiring into the correct places.
They've converted a hotel here in Calgary to condos and a work friend owns one.
It's not classified as affordable housing but the conversion is possible and should be done en masse.
Yeah, just look at how many abandoned buildings there are in most big cities. Seems like everything just expands outwards with new buildings rather than demolishing/converting old ones.
Are you telling me I could afford a Center City apartment if we don't return to the office? Sign me up
I don't know if the affordable part will be particularly accurate.
How come no one wants to talk about all the small business closing and people losing their jobs. This is a real tangible impact that shouldn’t be dismissed. I live in a big city and we’re all feeling the impact of people not returning to office work. Lack of revenue (small business, real estate, retail) is going to play a huge role in city budgets in the coming years. I work from home so I understand the appeal. Still, I don’t know how we, the city, come out of this.
America doesn't have communities. In a normal civilized country there would be grand plazas, city centers, districts to walk/shop/eat/live life.
We have work/home/and maybe a night out sometimes. We shouldn't be offloading thr responsibilities of city planners and band-aiding small business by forcing companies to hire in office staff.
We need better, more efficient cities in America, it is the reason everything is going to hell here.
Yes. That’s called a city. I don’t know what cities you have in mind but this is how I would describe my city of Philadelphia.
Yeah, and driving to park in a massive parking lot that takes an additional 5 minutes to get inside a store is not a shopping plaze, and no open air malls with no actual communities near them don't count as a "Third place"
Most cities west of the Mississippi river and really anything that's had a growth spurt since about the 1970s/80s. Half of the South there are cities with "historic downtown [this place]" signs all over an area that is slowly deteriorating and basically unused compared to the new main drag that is a freeway with the big box stores and fast food on the side.
Philadelphia was laid out before sprawl and when both parties worked at building stuff instead of being dedicated to tearing down government or being a big tent where everyone can argue with each other.
Sounds like you’re comparing a small town to a major city. We do have places in this country that meet your demands. And then there are smaller communities that don’t. And because lots of people prefer suburban sprawl over the convenience of living in a city, they may need to commute to where big business is.
If your small town is near an interstate or train track, and has open land, you may be lucky enough to have a decent size business break ground. Now more people can live closer to work. And now more people move to that town. And more small businesses open to support the growing community. And not far down the highway a mega strip mall opens. And within a few miles you have more homes and schools going up and now that train track has a train station. Congratulations, you now live in a small city. You got any sidewalks? Did they save any of that open land for parks? How’s the infrastructure holding up? How’s traffic?
That’s exactly what happening in the town I grew up in. I hated it and moved to an actual city. Life is relaxing and convenient and full of life. I have no car and use a bike public transportation. I more often walk to the stores and restaurants (those that haven’t closed yet). I engage with people (minimally) and find little joys in my daily life.
Now, imagine all of this if everyone just worked from home. There would be no need for a large corporate building or more homes or stores or schools. You’d have to drive further to the places where people live more densely for your everyday items. Or just rely on the miracle of the internet for someone to drop it at your door. Because as much as lots of people like suburban sprawl, they love not having to interact with anyone IRL.
Outside of Philadelphia is a region called The Mainline. It gets its name from the regional rail system that connects affluent suburbs with the city. I can’t tell you how many people I’ve spoken with who complain about living in the suburbs and having to drive one of the worst highways in the country for their morning commute. When I ask why they simply don’t drive a few minutes to the station and take a train in to their place of work, they look at me as if I had two heads. Because people don’t want to interact with anyone IRL. They rather waste hours a day in the confines of their own vehicle and scream so no one can hear them.
It’s not the cities that need to be fixed. It’s the American mentality of individualism and false security in isolation. This needs to change and then the cities will naturally follow in revival.
So, while I greatly appreciate the work from home perspective, there’s more to the story than real estate losing value.