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Many such cases
(lemmy.ml)
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this post was submitted on 28 Sep 2024
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You can fight the trolley itself instead of justifying supporting genocide.
PS this is the real world not a meme. Political power is not a trolley problem, it is a matter of organization and education. You disempower yourself and others by pretending you can only backseat cheerlead a genocide. Instead of supporting this, go and join an organization that is actually opposing it and start doing work.
In the US, every student is eventually presented with lessons on the Holocaust and asked to think about what they would do. Right now, to be honest, your answer would have to be, "support it using poorly thought out propaganda".
Absolutely. But you should also flip that switch real quick before getting to work fighting it. Just in case.
No, you shouldn't, because this is the real world and not a trolley problem. Providing electoral support to genociders helps to entrench them and these discussions have the wrong framing when it comes to how political power works. I already mentioned this. Did you read my comment?
Yes you absolutely should. If you can effortlessly vote for the lesser evil in a way that doesn't take anything away from the other fight, just do it real quick. Any argument to the contrary is accelerationism.
If you are an accelerationist, then get bent, you're wrong.
Backseat cheerleading genociders, and telling other people to do so, is not helping. It makes you complicit and spreads a false and anemic idea of how political power works. You should be fighting them, not doing mental gymnastics for how you can still justify supporting genociders.
There is nothing strategic in what you are describing, it is actually self-defeating and this is why you are told this logic from on high.
As I originally said, join an org and fo actual work against genociders. Be part of the solution, not part of the genocide-excusing problem.
There's no mental gymnastics to flipping that switch real quick, then fighting the real fight. It's you who's doing gymnastics trying to wrongly convince folks not to. The length of your post alone proves the gymnastics.
You're using a strained trolley problem analogy.
Anyone fighting the real fight has already been fighting and knows that your vote shaming for genociders is counterproductive.
How am I wrong?
My post was not long lol. Though most of it was me repeating myself because your response didn't address what I said. Same for this last response, too!
You are entirely missing pragmatism my friend. It's tragically important.
Your approach is not pragmatic, it is just what you have been told to do by your masters. It does nothing but entrench the genocuders and ensure that they will never have to think about you electorally. It's a self-defeat.
I speak in terms of building leverage and organizations.
Though really, the issue here seems to be that you refuse to engage with what I say.
No, you are ignoring 90% of what I say so that I have to repeat myself because you say things I've already contradicted. I assume this is a defensive reaction to having your genocide support called out.
If I was any of those things you could run circles around me and tackle my arguments. Instead you are avoiding and ignoring nearly everything I say. In contrast, I have addressed basically everything you have said, despite those behaviors.
You are now defensively lashing out rather than address what I said.
It's the opposite if engaging, it is playing with imaginary BS to continue lashing out rather than address what was said.
Your support for genociders is not strategic and you do not sound like someone that is actually doing anything else. You sound like someone that really wants to vote for those genociders and then stop thinking about it.
Say it then. Do you want Kamala or Trump to be president?
you: "Yes you absolutely should tacitly support genocide. If you don't tacitly support genocide then you're an accelerationist."
There are other candidates you can vote for that are vastly lesser evils than both the fascist democrats and fascist republicans; candidates who are not actively funding and perpetrating genocide but actually, get this, opposing it. If instead of voting for one of those, you still choose to support a party committing genocide, you aren't just an accelerationist and wrong, you're fucking despicable, evil.
False. It's too late. We're a month away from the election. Vote Kamala, the lesser evil, then join the Bernie campaign or the DSA to make some real change over the next 4 years. Now is pragmatically not the time for such battles. Know when to fold em.
"Now is not the time to oppose genocide."
Your reprehensibility is confirmed. History will look upon people like you as on those who supported Nazis but pretended the concentration camps were just a bit much.
Bad faith actor here. Mark this username.
Let's pretend for a second that voting blue would stop the slaughter at "just" the Palestinians (it doesn't).
If you think you're knowingly sacrificing an entire people to annihilation just so save your own skin, and you can not only live with that but argue in favor of it instead of redacting your entire government, you're a fucking nazi. Peddle your them-or-us genocide support somewhere else you blue maga piece of shit.
Amerikkkan lives mean nothing to me if those lives support genocide. I welcome the harm that will befall genocide-collaborating settlers.
There was a nazipost here
It's gone now
Just openly admitting you support genocide. Disgusting. And don't even pretend you care about anyone represented in the bottom half of the image; if Democrats said murdering trans folks was necessary to beat Trump, you'd support that too.
Time to sieze the trolley and build new tracks.
Fun fact: The United States actually has more than 2 parties
The More You Know
This message brought to you by Jill Stein who pops up every four years to grift money and accomplish nothing except cozying up to Putin. I guess there is still the brain worm dead animal guy?
Third parties in the US are unserious. I wish that weren't the case but that's the reality.
Let's steel man your argument and say you're 100% correct. Throwing away your vote or not voting is still morally better than voting for someone who won't commit to not enabling a genocide.
And that's assuming your predicate is correct, which it's not.
Oh, please tell me which third party candidate not only has a real shot at this election but is also not just a far-right grifter in disguise.
Pretty much all but the libertarian party. Turns out if enough people vote for a candidate they get elected. Weird huh?
A more accurate picture would have all of the people on the republican track on the democrat track too, just covered with a tarp to conceal their real aims.
Also, tha US flag shouldn't be on either track since neither of the two right wings of the capitalist party would dare throw away the empire that furthers their and their masters' (the capitalist class) interests.
I have a plan, hear me out,
The US rn:
Real life.
Is not.
A fucking.
Trolley problem.
You are actually allowed to break the car and turn off the power.