Agreed, that would have been a much better title. There's a lot of negativity around Mastodon -- the Twitter migration in 2022 is often described as a "failure". It certainly wasn't a success, but I see it much more as a missed opportunity.

Network effects are certainly a big deal but every social network has to deal with the issue, and some succeed. Addressing some of the reasons for bouncing not only improves retention, but makes it more likely that people recommend it to their friends. So many of the problems from July 2023's Mastodon Is Easy and Fun Except When It Isn’t were problems back in 2017 as well ... how much progress has Mastodon made? Fortunately other fediverse software's making more progress, but it's still frustrating.

There definitely are some great people there. Finding the right instance makes a big difference... unfortunately, almost eerybody starts off on mastodon.social, which for most people isn't a great choice, and don't realize they can move -- and when they do try to move, they lose their posting history which is annoying.

That was a great comment. It's frustrating because the fediverse should be good at making it easy for people to find topics their interested in ... but it doesn't work out that way in practice.

Yeah, Mastodon's interface has a lot of complexities. It drives me crazy when people say "just like email" ... here's the most recent diagram of what posts are visible in your federated timeline.

Yeah, right now the way I think of it is that Bluesky is (conceptualy) a single big instance, connected to the rest of the ActivityPub fediverse via Bridgy Fed (which speaks both AT and ActivityPub). Bluesky's decentralized in a different way, and the broader ATmosphere (apps that use AT protocol) is growing as well, but it deosn't really have the same concept of instance.

Good points! Agreed very much about all protocols growing, and that the ActivityPub fediverse is broader than just Mastodon.

https://erinkissane.com/mastodon-is-easy-and-fun-except-when-it-isnt is a good overview (not by me!) of issues that the November 2022 wave ran into. What's frustrating is that so many of these are very similar to the issues the April 2017 wave ran into!

Release 4.3 did some work on the recommended accounts, that's good, but the problems start even before that. What instance to sign up to? Most people have better experiences on smaller instances that match either their interests or their geography ... but how to find them? mastodon.social is (for most people) kind of meh -- certainly not the worst, but it's not all that well-moderated, and it's big enough that the local feed isn't useful for finding interesting people or stuff -- and that's now the default. Also it took over a year to get 4.3 out; I get it, they're a small team, some stuff turned out to be a lot harder than expected, and they had to deal with a bunch of security patches in the interim ... still, that means progress is frustratingly slow.

Bluesky certainly provides another option ... when Apartheid Clyde led to Twitter getting shut down in Brazil, there was a small bump in Mastodon's numbers, but a much bigger influx to Bluesky. Then again Bluesky's addressed a lot of problems people coming to Mastodon in 2022 had, and Mastodon hasn't, so if everybody had come to Mastodon instead the pattern would likely have repeated itself and most of them wouldn't have stuck around.

Agreed that there's a difference between funding and other kinds of engagement -- and a difference between initial funding to get them off the ground. Right now it's not exactly clear what funding Meta's contributed and what the longer-term plans are. One of the other polls in the thread was about transparency, and (at least so far) 90% of the respondents are saying that SWF should be transparent about the funding it's getting from Meta. And, another poll zeroes in on funding and has different options for initial and up-front, and whether or not there are any strings attached.

Thanks very much for wading in, @alyaza@beehaw.org - and thanks again to all the mods for taking action here. Any thread about racism in the fediverse becomes evidence of racism in the fediverse, sigh.

More positively, though, I got some very helpful feedback here from @Kwakigra@beehaw.org, @SweetCitrusBuzz@beehaw.org and @kalanggam@beehaw.org ... which is appreciated, and testimony to the fact that clearly a lot of people on Beehaw do get it!

No, "color blindness" perpetuates structural racism. Here's one study looking at that. Seeing Race Again Countering Colorblindness across the Disciplines has a lot more, although it's focused on law and academia.

Yeah, the section on "Listen more to Black people" didn't really cover the challenges on Lemmy. I added this:

If you're on a platform like Lemmy which doesn't yet have similar hubs, it's more challenging. One option is to use other social networks, news aggregators, and search engines to find articles, papers, and videos by Black people – and post them yourself to help others listen.

How's that?