163
submitted 2 years ago by Los@beehaw.org to c/technology@beehaw.org

Seventy-seven percent of middle-age Americans (35-54 years old) say they want to return to a time before society was “plugged in,” meaning a time before there was widespread internet and cell phone usage. As told by a new Harris Poll (via Fast Company), 63% of younger folks (18-34 years old) were also keen on returning to a pre-plugged-in world, despite that being a world they largely never had a chance to occupy.

top 50 comments
sorted by: hot top controversial new old
[-] SevYote@pawb.social 36 points 2 years ago

I call BS. I think this is something that people like to think that they believe, but they really don't.

The first time they found themselves standing in the kitchen and thinking, "How long am I supposed to cook chicken?" and realizing the only way to find out is to clean up, get dressed, drive down to the bookstore and find a cooking-for-beginners book, they'll be right back on board with the digital age.

Like, go watch early-seasons episodes of The X-Files and realize how many of the plot lines only work because the show started in a time that was pre-mobile phones, and then realize that kind of hilariously stupid and inconvenient situation was just, like, everyday life for everybody not so very long ago. Plan to meet a friend for lunch but they don't show up? You can decide to wait and risk eating alone, or go home, because there's literally no way to find out if they're just running a little late or if they're completely unable to come or what.

Sure, social media is a bit of a hellscape, but there is so much convenience that people take for granted that comes from cell phones and internet. I just do not believe more than a single-digit percentage of people would seriously enjoy going back for more than a few days, tops. No more than a camping trip.

[-] cykablyatbot@lemmy.fmhy.ml 7 points 2 years ago

Did you mean ride their bike to the library? Yeah. You're right on the money.
Also cars were much less reliable back then. Nothing like breaking down again and walking to a payphone... and that's just the beginning.

load more comments (1 replies)
[-] heartlessevil@lemmy.one 27 points 2 years ago

If you are longing for a world that you never lived in, there's probably some "grass is greener on the other side" in play. The world before smart phones was considerably worse. I bet that most of the people who are asking for this don't know how to read a paper map and have never seen a phone book.

The good news is that, if you don't want to use a smart phone, you can just... not. Nobody is forcing you. If you really wanted a world without smart phones you would already not be using one!

[-] Doom_Cough@kbin.social 9 points 2 years ago

That's not entirely true. I have twice in the last year had no other option than to install an app to use tickets I purchased. An many medical services refuse to do anything that isn't online or via an app. It's getting to be harder and harder to not need a mobile device. It's getting pretty stupid. Theine has been crossed already. I lived half my life without internet, I'd survive without it. But the world isn't headed in a direction that makes it feesible anymore unless you just completely check out.

[-] LostCause@kbin.social 7 points 2 years ago

A lot of banks here around me are closing cause they want people to use the online banking only, customer service barely existed in a long time now already anyway, but specifically for the TAN you need an app and thus smartphone. Not an issue for me personally as I‘m tied to all this through my job anyway, but for old people and technologically illiterate people it must feel pretty dystopian.

load more comments (5 replies)
[-] Ragnell@kbin.social 26 points 2 years ago

I bet this is more about the stress of being constantly available to your boss, your parents, your teachers, your neediest friends than about wanting a world without technology.

[-] alternative_factor@kbin.social 8 points 2 years ago

I think you're right on the money, I recently took a vacation and i had the luxury to turn everything off I wanted and truly enjoy it, most Americans can't do that.

[-] cykablyatbot@lemmy.fmhy.ml 7 points 2 years ago

Euros don't have to deal with that shit because they are smart enough to organize enough to end that crap.

load more comments (3 replies)
[-] patchymoose@rammy.site 25 points 2 years ago

I don't think people actually would, if push came to shove. They're just expressing nostalgia for a simpler time, which is pretty easy to understand, given all the dystopian effects of social media and smartphones.

I think smartphones have done a lot of harm, but they've still done far more good, which is why we use them. Especially in poorer countries where smartphones are often people's only access to the internet.

That said, there's nothing stopping any of these people in the article from being the change they want to see in the world. Not to send anybody to Reddit, but r/dumbphones is a fast growing subreddit for people that want to try that. A lot of the users are Gen Z who never got to try them and want to give it a whirl.

[-] shanghaibebop@beehaw.org 7 points 2 years ago

Yeah, I think people forgot how terrible it was before email, gps, and etc.

Remember having to find the yellow book to call a plumber only to not get anything after trying 5 numbers? Oh wait, you don’t know how bad they’ll be because there are no online reviews. Memos from your boss via sticky notes? Faxing shit over and over again?

I mean, this study says it all, people need to be paid almost 20k to not use any online search for a year, almost 9k to not use email in a year. These services provide huge value for us in our daily lives. https://mitsloan.mit.edu/ideas-made-to-matter/how-much-are-search-engines-worth-to-you

load more comments (1 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
[-] PenguinTD@lemmy.ca 24 points 2 years ago

I have trying to find the poll by following link and found nothing but this.

According to a new Harris Poll shared exclusively with Fast Company

So there is no actual source, no ways to check if the poll actually exist or not, no way to check if poll's question phrased in a way to get certain response, how many actually responded to the poll, etc. And, compare to most big news published poll result, a confidence and margin of error.

There for, I simply view this as click bait article to generate engagement, which it did.

[-] daitya@kbin.social 7 points 2 years ago

I too would be interested in the poll methodology and results - if there was such a poll. The Harris Poll website (https://theharrispoll.com/partners/media/fast-company/ ) doesn't show any such poll - at least not that I could find after scrolling through pages and pages of polls and then keying 'middle-aged americans' into the search bar.

[-] shanghaibebop@beehaw.org 5 points 2 years ago

It’s exactly counter to established research that places huge values on internet enables services.

https://mitsloan.mit.edu/ideas-made-to-matter/how-much-are-search-engines-worth-to-you

18k per year valued for search engines, 9k a year for email and 4K a year for maps.

Of course framing might be slightly different, but getting people to saying thing is very different than getting people to put money where their mouth is. I would much rather trust the dollar signal, especially in the US.

load more comments (2 replies)
[-] argv_minus_one@beehaw.org 22 points 2 years ago

Do people really want to go back to the dark ages before Wikipedia existed? I know I don't. Knowledge is power, and the Internet is a treasure trove of it, if you know where to look.

That said, I do want to go back to computers that obeyed only their users and no one else. Malicious hardware like TPM and Pluton is really scary.

[-] Sigmatank@midwest.social 11 points 2 years ago

I interpret this as really "people want to go back to a time before income inequality had ramped up as much as it has" but in their minds the overall feeling that the US is worse now for the non-elites is associated with other things

[-] DJDarren@beehaw.org 5 points 2 years ago

I think this is a part of it. Also, sprinkle in a good amount of wanting to go back to being younger.

But yeah, the golden era of the internet (whichever you deem that to be) felt way less fucky than what we’re dealing with now.

load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (3 replies)
[-] Uniquitous@lemmy.one 18 points 2 years ago

Do people not realize they can just log off? Go watch TV, it's still there. Turn off your phone, it has a power button. Read a book or go outside. None of the pre-internet options have gone away.

[-] nanometre@beehaw.org 9 points 2 years ago

I mean, yes, that is true for your spare time. But with the way things are working now, everything has to happen immediately, you might feel you need to be available 24/7, even if you don't technically.

Work in general is more fast-paced because of it (emails and phone calls over snail mail), everything you do is attached to your phone making it difficult to turn it off (banking, cards, travel apps, dating apps etc).

In the purest sense, yes, you can take breaks from it all, but it's still there, and while I don't think it'll happen anytime soon, I do believe we'd benefit as a society from being less chronically online (I say writing this on an app for a federated social media site, but y'know, small steps).

load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (1 replies)
[-] Grimace@beehaw.org 18 points 2 years ago

I like the internet. It's been integral in my life becoming myself. I've met some of my favorite people through it.

It's my hope that the era of social media comes to an end and the internet transitions back to how it used to be pre 2008 or so (iPhone and Facebook changed things), less centralized and all-consuming. A return to smaller communities as opposed to these larger algorithmic, advertiser-servicing platforms. Discord servers and focused forums. Communities of friends over public places to chase clout. In addition to handy services like shopping, banking, maps, etc. In essence, the internet as a tool rather than a social expectation. Because in many ways it is a really powerful tool, and I don't want to see that go away and I don't think it ever will at this point.

There are cracks showing in the social media model, Twitter and reddit in particular at the moment, but it yet remains a hope that we can turn it back to a more positive thing in our lives.

load more comments (1 replies)
[-] bartera@beehaw.org 16 points 2 years ago

This is also pretty common. People tend to think like that about everything they had in their formative years.

It's nostalgia plus a realization of how entrenched tech bureocratic processes have penetrated their lives, oftentimes making them worse, not better (many of the improvements are taken for granted).

But my point is you can take this "old times were better" in most of every case when doing these surveys. About music, TV and everything.

What people really want are the benefits without some of the cons that they've very willingly accepted out of laziness and/or ignorance.

They've lost a ton of privacy and rights and ability to discourse and act by being so heavily surveilled and "panopticon'd" into superficial uniformity of opinion.

Many of the things they complain about they can still do "non tech/non online" but it requires more effort than pretending that there should be just one way so they don't have to choose.

[-] FurtiveFugitive@lemm.ee 15 points 2 years ago

I feel like, for the 35-54 bracket at least, this must be less about giving up all the modern conveniences we have today but more about wishing they could raise their children in that simpler time. You don't want your kids to be left out of what's new and cool but you also don't want them exposed to EVERYTHING these platforms bring. It's a tight rope to walk and I'm not looking forward to it when my kids are older. I know a lot of people who have gone down the road of, "I didn't have a cell phone growing up, my kids won't either." But it's not very realistic in today's world.

[-] duncesplayed@lemmy.one 9 points 2 years ago

I agree with your assessment. I have a lot to say about this, and I'm glad to have found this article, as I've been having some serious inner turmoil about this lately, and this makes me feel a bit like I'm not totally alone or crazy. (But also I can't find a link to the original survey, which makes it hard to trust, as I can't find any description of the methodology or the exact wording of the questions)

I'm an older Millenial (sometimes consider Gen X, depending on the terminology used) with young kids. It's true that I would rather have them brought up 30 years ago than today. Sometimes when I see posts about parents letting their young kids (like let's say 10) have their own smartphone and then complain about, people get snarky like "You're the parent. If you don't like it, just take their smartphone away."

But it is a tightrope to walk. I don't want them expose them something like Instagram, which gives them eating disorders, depression, anxiety, chips away at their sense of privacy, etc. But I also don't want them to be "the weird kid" who can't relate to any of their peers. When I was growing up, I remember "the weird kid"s who weren't allowed to watch TV, weren't to play video games, etc. I can recognize that in many ways they probably benefited from not sitting in front of the TV for hours each day, but I can also recognize they probably didn't benefit from not being able to talk to any of the rest of us about the latest episode of Fresh Prince. I do see it as a balancing act between teaching them that there's a lot about their generation that sucks, but also letting them experience enough of it to see for themselves, and relate to the other kids around them.

load more comments (2 replies)
[-] tiredofsametab@kbin.social 14 points 2 years ago

As someone who is Gen X or millennial depending upon the day and the years they pick, I don't want this. It's very easy to look back through rose-tinted glasses, but there are a lot of things, which many commenters already touched on, that were much harder or worse then. One that I didn't see early was maps and navigation. I had to lug around a giant atlas and plan out my routes to get somewhere. If there were a new street or development or something, I was SOL. Even in the early days, printing out MapQuest maps was far better, but still had its own issues. Aside from that, many other commenters mention many of the things that were decidedly worse or more inconvenient back then.

load more comments (2 replies)
[-] shikitohno@kbin.social 14 points 2 years ago

I don't want to go back to a world without the internet or cell phones, but I would like expectations to change. Just because you can theoretically reach me at any time doesn't mean I'm obligated to respond to you or acknowledge you at any time. Whether it's work or personal acquaintances, I can't stand it when it's treated like a horribly rude thing to not immediately acknowledge and respond to any communication, no matter how trivial. A lot of times, I'm busy working on my own thing and don't want to kick off twenty minutes of back and forth texting over some trivial thing that's going to distract me from what I'm doing.

[-] mdhughes@lemmy.ml 13 points 2 years ago

Seems reasonable to me. I'm in the upper end of that range, center GenX (yes I know you don't remember us). I vary between wanting it to be 1970-2000. 1990 was nice, good industrial music, many of the old blues musicians were still alive & playing, computers were still fun, BBS's, the early non-shitty Internet, pagers and car phones if you wanted to be reachable that much, but you could just NOT be. Go out for cigarettes and never come back.

Anyone who thinks this panopticon hellscape we live in is better, is nuts.

[-] psudo@beehaw.org 17 points 2 years ago

I can't help but feel like a lot of the "the internet was better back in the day" is rose colored glasses. Things were just as fragmented, but were even less welcoming to our groups, there was more questionable content that people were trying to trick you into viewing. It definitely wasn't all bad, but it feels like it's coming from the same impulse as every other "things were better back in my day."

load more comments (3 replies)
[-] SkepticElliptic@beehaw.org 6 points 2 years ago

How much did a computer cost back then? How much were the first graphics cards? How compatible were computers with each other? How much did one album cost on CD? How easy was it to obtain information on a problem? How easy was it to price compare things between stores?

The issue is social media and allowing everyone to voice their immediate thoughts on things in pseudo anonymity. It's also the tendency of people to look at people's fake persona and then compare themselves to it. I could rent a Lambo for the weekend and use a filter like I'm actually fit and still have hair and make all my former classmates insecure because they never see me in person. That's the shit everyone wants to go away, they don't want to give up Spotify.

load more comments (3 replies)
load more comments (3 replies)
[-] corytheboyd@kbin.social 11 points 2 years ago

On one hand, shut it all down. We tried, it irreversibly melted the brains of billions.

On the other hand, mega rose tinted glasses. It wasn’t greener days for folks being systematically oppressed, as there was no concept of democratic news sources run by people.

Compromise: shit’s fucked, can’t change that. can control my own internet hygiene to avoid the doom bullshit, will do that.

[-] ajbin@kbin.social 11 points 2 years ago

As a baby GenX-er smartphones, and always-on internet didn't come into my life until I was at university so I straddle both worlds, and I definitely would not go back. What I have done in recent years is revolt against the always-on side of modern tech. My phone makes not a peep of sound or vibration, it shows no notifications unless I look in the tray, all app badges are turned off. I can't tell you how much this has improved my life!

I even went so far to run my phone in black and white for 6 months as an experiment. That was a real interesting experience! I found it way easier to simply read and then put down my phone. When I finished my stint and turned colour back on I actually felt dizzy using the phone for a few days.

When you look at how Kbin/Lemmy has exploded in a just a few short days it's clear that modern tech can be amazing for humanity in terms of creating communities and bringing people together, but how we do it in terms of app designs, notifications, dark patterns and all the hullabaloo of is somehow anti-human and I think with waves hands all that has befallen us in the past couple of years we are suddenly waking up and trying to find new ways to be people with tech.

Let's hope the fediverse is a good step in that new direction.

[-] greenskye@beehaw.org 8 points 2 years ago

This. I think people are equating the current capitalistic hellhole the internet has become with the much more reasonable approach society took pre-internet. The tools and capability are good, the uses they're being used for currently are not.

[-] density@kbin.social 9 points 2 years ago

Or you just stood around waiting for a person for 2 hours with no way to learn if they were running late or blowing you off or dead.

[-] lavendedreams@waveform.social 6 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago)

Honestly, people committed to plans in a way they don’t now. I rarely had last minute cancellations when I was younger. Time might have been cut short or something, but people showed up. Changes of plans happened well in advance. Occasionally, I got stood up, but it was rare.

Now, I’d say probably 20-30% of the time, plans get changed last minute or more rarely, somebody bails.

Otherwise, yeah, having a mobile computer/phone in my pocket is indispensable and I’d never fully give it up.

load more comments (1 replies)
[-] duraks@kbin.social 5 points 2 years ago

Mobile phones were widespread well before smartphones were invented.

load more comments (1 replies)
load more comments (1 replies)
[-] wxboss@beehaw.org 9 points 2 years ago

(TDLR: Technology (in its infancy) was something new, exciting, fun and enjoyable. Today, it is manifested more as an overlord whose primary capacity is to spy, intrude and take your personal information in order that they might gain from it.)

I grew up in a world before all of the modern day technology took over. They were good times, but when technology did eventually begin to develop, it effects were initially benign. It was initially adopted by those who were considered 'geeks' and people who were willing to spend money on it (even IBM clones such as the Tandy 1000 were going for $1,000 back in the day).

I remember when pagers were coming on the scene and allowed people to reach out to each other if they weren't at home or at work (which were the only places they had access to a reachable phone number). It gave greater freedom for those who were in positions where they were on call 24x7 - it allowed them to go places and still be reachable instead of being stuck at home and waiting for a phone call that might never come.

Of course, things grew from there which provided many other benefits including access to a huge repository of information. Nowadays, that access to information has become a means of harvesting information from the very individual seeking to obtain it. The innocence of what was once revolutionary has been been upended by and ideology that has figured out and embraced how to consume its own consumers.

I spend more time today figuring out how to keep my data and personal information private and secure. Using Linux on my computer, running GrapheneOS on my phone as well as other considerations all in an attempt to keep at bay invasive companies and their ever evolving techniques in order to pry and spy upon me. It's a shame that what was once fun and exciting is now something to be feared.

load more comments (12 replies)
[-] jprjr@kbin.social 8 points 2 years ago

I think what people are really missing is being able to feel disconnected.

Like it used to be you'd send an email and you'd get a response tomorrow. Because people would go online occasionally.

Now if I'm not responding to a text within a few minutes people get upset. You'll see people answer the phone during a movie to say "hey I'm in a movie I'll call you back"

I'd like to go back to the world of being connected but having a slight Friday is ok

load more comments (3 replies)
[-] Zagaroth@beehaw.org 8 points 2 years ago

Been there, done that, and fuck no.

But I also have no problems with leaving my phone on Do Not Disturb and reading a book. I am happy to ignore the world. I don't let connectedness rule me. I use it.

Usually. I also have ADHD, so sometimes I just need my stimulation

[-] Hexorg@beehaw.org 8 points 2 years ago

I agree with the commenters who said people miss certain things but forget about convenience of the connected world. I wanted to add that people likely misattribute their nostalgia to unconnected world because they were kids. It felt great being a kid not because we were pre-internet, but because we were kids. We had no bills to worry about. We’d always have food. And that was the only food we ever knew about so we loved it. Our worries were to just have enough time in the day to play all the cool things with friends and explore the world. We didn’t feel guilty for just playing video games the whole day or hanging out with friends the whole day. Our bodies could fall from a tree and our bruises would heal in a week. We’d find a motherfucking ant and be fascinated by it for hours! Have you tried staring at ants now? It’s mindnumbingly boring. Of course we miss the way we felt when we were kids. Technology ha nothing to do with it. Every generation misses being a kid.

[-] Fizz@lemmy.nz 8 points 2 years ago

I am 26 and I dont want to return. I grew up before the internet getting dial up when i was about eight. The problem isnt the internet its biliondollar services that make their money through getting as much attention as humanly possible.

load more comments (2 replies)
[-] Silviecat44@vlemmy.net 7 points 2 years ago
[-] hotwarioinyourarea@slrpnk.net 7 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago)

"middle-age Americans (35-54 years old)"

35 is middle-aged??

load more comments (6 replies)
[-] asjmcguire@kbin.social 7 points 2 years ago

They might say that, but they don't really mean "the internet" - they mean social media. Which I can understand, I was bullied "offline" when I was at school, but at least when I got home - I had respite. I can't imagine how stressful it is these days for kids, being bullied online, getting home and still being bullied.

load more comments (2 replies)
[-] Powderhorn@beehaw.org 7 points 2 years ago

Not a lot of meat to the story, and it conflates tech itself with the social expectations that have sprung up because of it and the way it's used. "Instagram's pedophile network" (which seems only to be brought up for shock value) is not "cell service."

I'd hazard a guess that what respondents really want to return to not being expected to be available to anyone at any time. And, crucially, they don't feel they can just ... do that.

[-] norb@lemmy.norbz.org 7 points 2 years ago

I’d hazard a guess that what respondents really want to return to not being expected to be available to anyone at any time. And, crucially, they don’t feel they can just … do that.

I think you hit the nail on the head here. People want to go back to a time when it wasn’t possible, but I think even more importantly where it wasn’t expected, that you are available 24/7/365.

The good thing is we can, as a society, start to not expect that availability.

load more comments (1 replies)
[-] TheButtonJustSpins@infosec.pub 7 points 2 years ago
[-] conciselyverbose@kbin.social 6 points 2 years ago

Hard fucking pass.

Getting away from it at times is great. I love spending time climbing a mountain or hiking around a lake with a camera looking for cool shit. But the net positive from smart phones is massive.

Now, if I could make Facebook and every piece of software its ever written vanish into thin air, I'd be all for that. And there are other bad actors with inappropriate influence as well. But on the whole there are too many positives.

[-] sexy_peach@feddit.de 6 points 2 years ago
load more comments (2 replies)
[-] P1r4nha@feddit.de 5 points 2 years ago

A majority of Americans are over 50, so that's no surprise, but so many under 50 and 35 too? That's a surprise. Then why is the public so captivated by it? You don't need to use it for most things.

load more comments
view more: next ›
this post was submitted on 17 Jun 2023
163 points (100.0% liked)

Technology

37804 readers
406 users here now

A nice place to discuss rumors, happenings, innovations, and challenges in the technology sphere. We also welcome discussions on the intersections of technology and society. If it’s technological news or discussion of technology, it probably belongs here.

Remember the overriding ethos on Beehaw: Be(e) Nice. Each user you encounter here is a person, and should be treated with kindness (even if they’re wrong, or use a Linux distro you don’t like). Personal attacks will not be tolerated.

Subcommunities on Beehaw:


This community's icon was made by Aaron Schneider, under the CC-BY-NC-SA 4.0 license.

founded 2 years ago
MODERATORS