Ha, fuck you. My life was destroyed by disability, and the only drug that was helping me went from $250 a month to $3000 a month between 2015 to 2017. Everything got worse, to the point I can’t even afford to live.

This especially pisses me off.

Fuck you Vance and fuck everything you just said. It’s all lies.

Walz: "Well I don't run Facebook and Trump lost."

I will say that I worry about Vance as a candidate when he’s no longer directly tied to Trump and his madness. He’s the face of non-truth leading to fascism.

"Under Kamala Harris' leadership."

I wish Walz would say that JOE BIDEN IS THE FUCKING PRESIDENT.

"Did he lose the 2020 election?"

"OH YEAH?!?! Well did Kamala Harris censor people?"

vance won't answer if trump lost the 2020 election. oh its the lauph into cry now. man he is so weasily.

It's crazy how... like. Normal? This debate is. I mean they obviously disagree on stuff, but there's at least a baseline of respect here so far.

"She hasn't accomplished what she set out to do in three years" is kind of weird for the running mate of the guy who accomplished fuck all in terms of his campaign promises for four.

"Should we force catholic hospitals to do abortions?"

No. Because there shouldn't be catholic hospitals.

Vance after the Debate

Listening to these idiotic "uncommitted voters" in the focus group are the absolute worse. It's a collection of people that love the attention of being an indecisive moron.

To Vance's credit, he's doing a monumental amount of damage control and sanewashing for Donald Trump and is doing a decent job at it. Yes Vance is lying through his teeth with each answer but he is markedly better at keeping his cool compared to the former Narcissist-in-Chief against VP Harris. It's a position Walz wouldn't envy. So overall I think this is within the best range of events Vance could expect.

They both did well at acknowledging each other and keeping this like a somewhat normal debate, can you imagine. That said, if any viewer can hold a thought without focusing solely on whatever deflection each candidate is doing, Walz is giving better answers, and Vance is putting way more false equivalencies in.

Walz is doing very well with his answers, he's not as calculated and rehearsed as Harris, and you know having a heart makes you mess up more than the recently changed telephone options menu, but he is doing a fantastically better job at connecting with voters than Vance did. Walz's jabs are quick and easily missed ("Wharton") but even with apolitical people, if they understand Walz's language then they'll get when he is jabbing at Vance.

Obviously I was hoping Vance would fold up into a chair and was disappointed for that to not happen. More than that though is that I'm crossing my fingers the news cycle doesn't begin pretending it's a normal election cycle just because the VP candidates could actually look each other in the eye for a night. Idk, give it 48hours and Trump will be starved enough of attention to break the spell and make people glare at him again in disgust.

Vance lies like he breathes, but he isn’t mentally addled like Trump. He’s a threat. A long term threat.

Walz should have just called it out right there: your running mate is a reality denying narcissist, and you're his lapdog. You won't say he lost because you're scared daddy will yell at you if you do.

Walz drove it home on the threat to democracy, and Vance had nothing to respond.

Vance: I did wanna answer your question, because you did ask it...

Narrator: He did not answer her question.

It just occurred to be that Vance is running for president not VP. I don't think he thinks Trump will get through his term if elected.

Morning after thoughts:

• Walz is not actually a bad debater. He's not polished and practiced, but his command of policy and numbers means he still comes across as fairly confident. He knows what he knows, and that can stand in for polish.
• Vance didn't do badly, but I genuinely can't remember any of his answers, and that's kind of weird. I think it's because he answered like he'd been raised by a generative AI instead of human parents. Seriously, can anyone actually remember anything he said, without looking it up?
• Walz had more flubs. But he also got in a lot more hits. It remains to be seen which will stick in the minds of voters more, if either.
• The lack of Trump on the stage made this one a lot more mature. It's amazing what a difference it makes when one of the debaters isn't a demented man-baby.

The way I see it, Walz's clearly superior command of policy details, and the way that fact-checkers are counting nearly everything Vance said as a lie, gives Walz the technical win, while Vance gets the nod for being more polished. In the end, I don't think this debate will matter much to the election.

Those with an interest in history might remember that back during the 1988 election, Lloyd Bentsen absolutely demolished Dan Quayle, George H.W. Bush's pick for VP, in a debate. But it was forgotten in a matter of days - if not hours - and Bush went on to win handily.

I think this debate will likely be forgotten soon, too.

Vance digging deep into the reddit school of debate. ‘Explain to me how my lie is untrue please. I’ll derail all other talk until then.’

Vance literally said nothing about Trump's healthcare plan. They still have nothing.

A little more than an hour in...

Vance has been exactly as polished as expected, other than a slightly rough start coming off as robotic. He's managed a few genuinely human-seeming moments, too, especially upon learning that one of Walz's kids witnessed a shooting. But he's been lying nearly constantly.

Walz isn't as polished, but he's been doing much better in that department than I would have expected, while still coming off as very nice and genuine. He's had a couple of flubs, but none of them were debate killers, while he's gotten in far more actual hits than Vance, by far. Like, it's not even close.

There's another thing: Vance is legitimately boring to listen to. I didn't realize this before, but his voice could be used as a sleep aid.

I'm biased. I'll own that. So take from this what you will: I think Walz is winning. It's close, but I think he's coming off as more honest and more real, while Vance is coming off as dishonest and plastic.

“Why won’t you rebut my lies?”

“They aren’t true”

“Ok but like why won’t you explain how?”

Who is banning books right now JD?!?

The housing shortage is caused by illegal immigrants and not drilling for oil? I have no words.

Vance: "Women don't trust us because we are against abortion. We'll make them trust us by making fertility treatments more accessible."

What?

lol Vance did not want to answer that elector question.

The pregnant pause from the moderator followed by her mystified question made me laugh out loud.

I did it. I opened a private tab and checked Truth Social. Trump is obsessed with Walz misspeaking on school shooters. He also screamed in all caps that he would veto a national abortion ban. Also his usual weird fixation with the moderators’ ratings in other shows, and still asserting that anyone who said he lost in 2020 is lying.

LOL! "Thank you, senator, for describing the legal process."

What a crazy attack from Vance, why isn't the Vice President fixing the housing crisis? Wasn't Trump President and didn't fix real issues with in his purview.

“NRA used to teach gun safety” is a great line for purple states.

Vance: "The white guys shooting up schools with legally purchased guns are the fault of immigrants."

"from AOC to Dick Cheney to Taylor Swift."

Taylor Swift confirmed more right-wing than Cheney!1!

Finally Waltz telling him the VP isn't responsible, Congress is. I think he's slipped that in a couple times now.

Wait there’s more? I am going to bed.

No, you dick. Walz was right and everything you said wasn’t true. Everything got worse under trump, and I have fucking receipts.

I'm enjoying the fact that CBS brought receipts about Vance's past statements about Donald Trump.

Damn I was a bit worried that we weren't going to get the decisive soundbite, but all anyone is going to talk about tomorrow is going to be the "did Donald Trump lose?" mic drop. Absolutely savage.

Housing too expensive? DRILL BABY DRILL!!

Maybe let’s fund national health care!

Guns are flowing into the United States from Mexico?

Wat??!

Guns go from the US to Mexico, not the other way. Another blatant lie.

Vance: “Our policies aren’t our policies. We actually support your favored policies. You’re not allowed to fact check me. I’ll go back to our real policies tomorrow.”

"Do you want to support Catholic hospitals to perform abortions against their will?" FUCKING YES.

Vance is trying really hard to convince people they're getting paid better than they did before Trump.

Mics got cut. Nice.

Jd vance: the biggest threat to democracy is censorship

Fucking wild take

"I don't really want to talk about the 2020 election, so Google sucks and also Tulsi Gabbard and RFK, Jr. likes me."