One of the major reasons people shy away from EV is the range. This is great to bring more people to EVs.
However, what policies is EU passing to improve the network of public transport such as buses, trams, and trains?
People worry about range too much. Over 95% of trips are under 50 miles and less 1% are over 100 miles in the US. I imagine Europeans cover even less distance on average. Every new EV out there will be able to cover 99% of trips. Most newer EVs have at least a 250 mile range which you should probably stop and take a break in that time period anyway.
In the US, our problem is number of home chargers is horrible. A level 1 charger will get you 35-40 mile range each day. That would be perfectly fine for people in apartments and most people in general. Apartment buildings and condos largely do not even have that though. About 14% of people live in apartments and about 5% live in condos. That means a large chunk of the population does not have easy access to charging. A little over a third of Americans rent (houses and apartments). There is not much incentive for am owner to install a level 1 charger let alone install a 240v outlet. That means those people will currently have to give DC fast charging stations. Those are much more expensive, take a long time, and because Electrify America was only done to satisfy VW's legal requirement, many are purely maintained and broken.
That situation is even worse in Europe because there is a higher percentage of people living in flats at about 46%.
With the 99% number If you drive every day that's still 3-4 trips a year when your car will be unable to get you to where you want to go. And with electric cars still being very expensive that is not a good look when a much cheaper ICE vehicle has essentially no such limitation.
It doesn't help that I have zero trust in the charging infrastructure in Europe at the moment, so completing this proposal is actually what would make electric cars fully viable in my eyes.
Obviously they are already great if you have 2 vehicles in a household where one can complete the longer trips with ease. You really get to enjoy the many upsides during your daily commute where range isn't really a factor.
You won’t be unable to go, you’ll just have a stopover after 300 miles. You know, like you normally would, anyways.
99% are under 100 miles (161km) . Most EVs have a range of at least 250 miles (~400km). Even if you are going more than that, you are not stuck on the side of the road. You just have to find your way to a DC fast charge station and hang out for a half our while your car charges. ICE vehicles also have a range limitation. As for cost, yes, EVs are pricier but are cheaper to operate (electricity is cheaper than gas and maintenance is much cheaper) and are cost equivalent after 6-7 years compared to an ICE.
As for trust in the infrastructure in Europe, I can't speak to that. It just got much better here in the US because most auto companies decided on Tesla's plug as the standard so now all of those are open to most cars. Before that, you were likely using an Electrify America station. VW was required to build those for chatting emissions tests and they have invested very little in maintenance.
The EU is likely better, to be honest. From what I can find, there are over twice the amount of fast charge stations in the EU compared to the US.
https://www.iea.org/reports/global-ev-outlook-2022/trends-in-charging-infrastructure
You just have to find your way to a DC fast charge station and hang out for a half our while your car charges.
You make it sound like DC fast chargers are everywhere, when they most certainly are not.
This is just one area of the overall fit for 55 and general EU plans. Public transport is already being looked at under different working groups (e.g. https://rail-research.europa.eu/about-europes-rail/).
The aim of the overall plan look very promising. https://www.consilium.europa.eu/en/policies/green-deal/fit-for-55-the-eu-plan-for-a-green-transition/
Regarding the range problem, that is my personal conspiracy theory. It makes a lot of sense but no way that I or anyone can ever prove it.
Theory: Range was never a real problem and car manufacturers seeded that topic to journalists/press, as the companies already had the solution available before communicating the problem.
More range is done with a larger batteries, usually higher quality cells/chemicals. So making the car bigger and more expensive. That's what manufacturers desire to do and sell anyways.
It never was or is a real problem. They can just charge the customers more and it's solved.
As I've already seen posted, the real problem that cannot be easily solved is the charging time. Right now I 'charge' 0% to 100% in 1-2 minutes. No preparation, no special fuel, no special fees or subscriptions, no fuel stations only for specific brands, no apps, summer or winter same 1-2 min, no strain on the fuel tank by filling fast, sometimes waiting lines at the stations but they move quickly with 1-2 min per vehicle.
I don't see battery or charging tech anywhere close to that in the next 5, 10 or even 20 years.
That's hard to advance, with decades of research behind us and decades ahead, so car manufacturers focus on their favorite topic: range, where they can just throw their customers money at to solve it immediately.
I think the bigger societal problem is that people need to start thinking differently of how charging works. It won't and doesn't need to work like refueling.
What I mean is, nobody would refuel every day at the beginning of their 10km commute. What they'll do is commute for 2 weeks, and when the car is empty they'll refuel and then continue on their way.
With EVs, this can be different. Once chargers (and not even fast chargers) are placed on every major location, you don't need to go 0-100% in 99% of the cases. Getting groceries? Charge at the store for 30mins Going to the gym? Charge there for an hour or two Going out for dinner? Charge for 3h
The car doesn't need to go empty all the way. Obviously you can't do that with the current infrastructure, but with enough effort, that's easily achievable.
Those are various ideas regarding charging problematic.
I'm still on the range topic that people apparently see as the main problem with EVs but I don't. I'd be even fine with less range than the current top models offer.
For the US, I could see people having an EV with a smaller battery for commuting and one with a larger battery for longer family outings. But also maybe not. If solid state batteries can actually be commercially available, charge time and range will not be issues. If you can charge 500km in 5-10 minutes like Toyota is claiming with theirs, nobody is going to care too much about range of their car can be recharged in about the time it takes an ICE vehicle.
Range was definitely a major problem for early adopters - because at the time there weren't many places you could charge the car.
And now that it's set in everyone's mind, it continues to be talked about.
I guess it will be great in the wealthier countries. Here in Spain the reason EV's are incredibly rare is simply the cost.
And rather than making them more affordable the Government just makes ICE vehicles more expensive to use, which is almost a regressive tax on those too poor to afford an EV. Especially given in many areas it's not really optional given public transport may be unreliable or non-existent.
you could elect people who will expand public transport... we did it, went from 4 buses a day to an hourly schedule, middle Mosel region Germany, come by our wine is better =P
I lived in Germany for some months in University.
The trains there are amazing, it really feels like you can get just about anywhere by train. In Spain, we have good connections between major cities but you can't really use them to go on day-trips to places like the castles or the salt mines or whatever.
Seriously. Do people really think EVs will save us from climate change? They are hardly good for the environment. There's already a sustainable EV, it's called a train.
And don't get me started on electrical scooters... How is that more sustainable than a bike....
Although I like big public transportation options, cars are also awesome and won’t be going anywhere for the foreseeable future. I’d rather have electric cars than gas cars as we can generate renewable electricity but not renewable gas.
I’ve seen your argument a few times now. In San Francisco, some folk are protesting self driving cars with cones because they want more public transportation infrastructure. Again, I’m sympathetic—I love public infrastructure. But improving public transportation doesn’t have to be antithetical to EVs.
the problem with cars is still like 30-50% of usable area is converted into roads and parking, which means things are 30-50% further apart, which means it takes at least 30%+ longer for people to complete a transportation loop, which creates 30%+ more traffic while putting more people out of walking distance.
This compounding effect of parking really means cities without alternatives to cars result in higher housing costs, more wasted space, and more congestion than cities with less dedicated car infrastructure, and it raises agricultural prices as farmers compete with suburbs for land.
Its one of the deep inefficiencies of the american "cars only" system of transit.
Edit: This isnt even getting into things like the safe area of travel for kids has been reduced by like 95% from like 100 years ago and the many other problems resulting from society having to sacrifice monstrous amounts of safety and community protections to make cars just barely work in most cities.
I don't have anything against trains, but our rail network is really limited.
If I want to go from Barcelona to Madrid, it's easy and actually more convenient than flying albeit more expensive.
But if I want to take my kids to go and see the cool medieval castle in the mountains? There's no train going anywhere near there.
E-Scooters are much better in conjunction with public transit as they take up much less space and are easier to take up steps to the platform.
As such they are a good personal transportation option to solve the 'last mile'.
I do however think that public, shared E-Scooters are a big nuicance to a citys center especially
a lot of the shared E-Scotter thing is local cities not wanting them to exist in the first place, replace a parking spot every once in a while with a scooter collection point and watch as they almost completely disappear from the side of the road, we give the literally worse in every aspect cars their own dedicated infrastructure that is choking our cities, but a scooter? no, that's untenable...
I disagree. Foldable bikes are a thing here, and many people use them together with public transport. Go to town with train, go to office from trainstation with bike
Anyone know how the price of electricity from these chargers compares to prices in the home?
I just wonder about possible non-car use-cases. E.g. someone is off the grid and they use a cargo cycle to bring batteries¹ to one of these charging stations. Will they be fleeced on price, or are there subsidies that could perhaps make the cost lower than household electric?
① asking w.r.t. both lead-acid batteries and li-ion, though I suspect these chargers would be li-ion only.
Currently these charge points cost more than at home, and i believe it will stay this way. There is more overhead and more companies connected to the highway chargers so more people looking to make a profit. There is also the fact that currently ( and thats what these laws want to change ), you need some kind of subscription to use these public chargers, so even more costs :)
Dont get me wrong though, its not like public charging is like 2€/kW vs 0.35kW at home, but there is like a 10c/kW difference
In places that don't have EV chargers currently, will it be the state's responsibility to install them?
On Finland's highways highlighted on the ball in that article, there are a lot of existing gas stations that have EV chargers. But there can easily be more than a 60km gap, especially the further north you go. Is it down to the state, local municipality, or EU to fund it?
Furthermore, if a commercial provider, like a gas station shuts down, would some authority be required to at least keep the EV chargers running?
How is the 60km distance calculated? From existing EV chargers? If a gas station closes, the measuring point to/from the next/previous EV charger will change.
I can't imagine the state will want to install EV chargers every 60km in addition to the ones already provided by commercial enterprises such as gas stations. Will they be required to?
It says in the article 'Lightly trafficked roads or locations that just don’t make socio-economic sense can be excluded from the requirement' for the comprehensive network.
It'll be up to each country how they decide to implement it. In some countries the core roads are managed by a central government agency so they would need to arrange it. In others it is the the local municipalities or privatised. Some countries will offer to private companies. Others will provide it themselves. The governments would be ultimately responsible but Im sure they can manage this given they already have responsibilities about maintaining the roads and rest areas. In the worst case they might have to pay for some infrastructure themselves but can make it back with the charges.
Infrastructure is a big consideration that is sort of glossed over by governments enacting legislation to force the adoption of electric cars. When gas powered cars initially came about, law makers and manufactures had to go to some lengths to set up an infrastructure for fuel delivery and accessibility. It wasn't just about making the cars, a whole system had to be deployed.
Not much thought about infrastructure has gone into the adoption of electric cars. It could easily end up being a situation where there's too many cars and not enough support. The EU is already thinking ahead, but I think its likely the USA will get caught with their pants down.
For example California has already enacted legislation forcing all new cars to electric after 2035, but has not passed any legislation about infrastructure for them. There are over thirty million privately registered cars in California. You need places to charge all of them and support the power demand for it. The power grid in its current state would not be able to do it. They already have problems when existing demand gets too high. So it's not going to be a small issue by any means.
I'd love to have an electric car, but yeah, shortage of charging stations in the USA and also they're more expensive. Though what I'm paying in gasoline would offset that an amount. Also cheaper maintenance (other than replacing the battery). No problem for me on daily driving range, but doing a long trip with one would require some planning.
From what I understand, the car will help you plan your trip with charging stations along the way. At least, that’s what Teslas do.
Even if you don't have a Tesla there are a handful of apps out there that will help.
Now if we could get everyone on the same stupid plug - but thats a different conversation.
I find it crazy that the plug hasn’t been defined and made universal. They mandated USB-C, I’m sure they can figure out something for car chargers.
This is great, and ambitious.
I wish it was more ambitious with a fatter timeline.
I'd rather see passive charging lanes added by 2030 or something.
But again, this is great.
Charging lanes are still a pipe dream as long as inductive charging wastes about 1/3 of energy used.
This is a most excellent place for technology news and articles.
