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this post was submitted on 08 May 2024
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He and his party are doing the calculus and figuring that they'll do better supporting Israel because, frankly, where else are those voters going to go? Trump? He'd nuke Gaza if Netanyahu co-signed a loan for him.
Democratic voters need to vote blue no matter who, and then primary out the corporatist candidates at the earliest opportunity.
This has to be a two-pronged effort: keep the Republicans out of office permanently, and clean the Democratic slate from within.
This is really the only strategy and we've seen how incredibly effective it has been as the GOP changes into rabid racists.
But better democrats can't employ exactly the same strategy as their far right insurgent counterparts, because we're not racists assholes trying to undermine democracy.
That was what we said in 2020 and here we are. We went backwards from Obama. Either he does the right thing or there have to be consequences.
Yeah, but the consequences is a second Trump administration if you don't vote for a Democratic candidate for president, and two to four more years of legislative gridlock if the Republicans aren't reduced to powerless rump.
Do you want a second Trump administration? Think really hard about that, because the last one vacillated between "Berlusconi-level incompetency" and "Mussolini-level malice".
The stakes really are to high to "try to teach Biden and the Democrats a lesson", and it's not like corporate Democrats really care, because they'd rather lose to a Republican than get primaried by a progressive and stop the gravy train forever, plus they have this weird idea that if they're "civil" they won't find themselves lynched during the American Krystallnacht.
The problem with not primaring out corporate Democrats is that American voters...didn't do it. Not that it didn't work as a strategy, because replacing corporate Republicans with fascist nutjobs is working out just fine. Maybe progressives, or at least progressive Millenials and Gen-Xers, really are too lazy to affect real change?
I'm sure allowing a manchild narcissist authoritarian insurrectionist to appoint more judges and sell more state secrets will teach Biden and the Dems a big lesson. 1/3 of SCOTUS were installed by an insurrectionist and about 1/2 of the House and Senate are backing an insurrectionist.
I agree, the Democrats can do literally anything (up to and including supporting genocide) so long as they're marginally less bad than Republicans and we should support them for this reason. This strategy has no foreseeable consequences and can only make things better in the long run.
Yeah it's pretty grim. But political parties don't listen to anything but votes and power. They aren't benevolent organizations. If they won't listen to the people who voted for them last time, then voting for them this time just tells them they can ignore you.
So it's privileged to oppose genocide, cracker? It's privileged to turn one's back on murderers who do nothing for us, cracker? It's suddenly okay to weaponize disorders I'm certain you've never studied, because you're not getting your omnicidal way, cracker? What's really astonishing is watching you crackers resort to every libel and slander in the book when the actually civilized world won't go along with your butchering, cracker.
Sounds like Democracy is working as expected? The people want the death of American democracy, you should probably ask yourself why you are so keen on supporting it.
There are a disturbing number of people who give no shits about this and instead think not voting for Biden will send a productive message.
It is sadly funny when you think about it.
Biden loses
Democrat politicians: "Oh no, we only have all of our wealth to protect us from the worst effects of the US falling into a fascist hellscape. Those voters sure showed us!"
I mean there's a reason "cut off your nose to spite your face" is a saying about being super wise and practical
What's even scarier is those same people seem completely oblivious to the alternative, which is Mr. "Muslim Ban, Shithole Countries, I like Jewish people counting my money, I'd just nuke the whole place" Trump.
Like, your problem is genocide and you'll basically pave the road for the candidate that explicitly said they'd do a genocide, and whose supporters would cheer him on as the missiles launched, over one that you have some influence over?
Wasn’t it determined that the primaries are not a democratic vote, but a suggestion the DNC will keep in mind when they ultimately dictate who will run? The real people who choose are super delegates who are insiders who vote to maintain the status quo. So claiming the primaries are the correct venue would not be correct.
Bernie won a primary. AOC won a primary. Clearly the DNC isn't all-powerful. We have to get as many progressives in every position that we can.
Specifically not a primary for president. The statement that primaries are the place to make the party change are false and i consider it maliciously so.
President is just one primary of thousands all across the country. All the fascist laws being passed in red states? That's being done by Republicans at the state level and the president can't do can't do anything about it.
Then you won’t mind if people protest vote during the presidential election.
I don't mind if people protest vote during primary elections - that's what they're for. Protest voting in a two party system is shooting yourself in the foot unless you like the other guy running.
This feels a lot like giving your little brother a disconnected controller so he stops bothering you.
Republicans love that you think like that. They make sure to vote in every election.
If enough people actually protest vote in a primary, it will affect who is in the election.
That has not happened once in the 24 years I've been voting. In literally every election, even odd years.
...Because not nearly enough people get out and vote, especially in primaries.
Like I said: It's like handing your kid brother a controller that doesn't work. I keep pressing the button but nothing happens.
And as long as everyone isn't doing their part, it won't. That's how democracy works. The ones who vote get to decide everything. Republicans vote.
Yeah but I'm voting and don't decide shit
Because you're one of many. The many who agree with you need to vote, too, because the ones who don't sure do.
It still feels fucking useless
I know, our electoral system sucks and is very demoralizing. But giving up completely means letting the fascists win. I refuse to do that.
It seems like the fascists are gonna win anyway
They might. But it won't be because I personally didn't do anything to oppose them.
Voting seems like the least effective thing you could do
And yet, their supporters vote all the time. Now why would they do that if it's so useless? Also, not voting at all is the least you can do.
Because they know there's more of them than us and can win easily. I'd be a lot more enthused about it if I got results, too.
No, there's actually a lot more of us than them. The combination of gerrymandering and 2 senators per state gives them far more representation than they should have, then add in non-conservative voters being much less likely to vote and they end up with minority rule. But it's not inevitable - if everyone else voted in the same percentages as they do, they wouldn't have a majority in Congress or be in the White House ever again.
If your solution to a problem is "Everyone should just..." then it's not a solution. Plus it sounds like not only is the controller disconnected, it's designed to not work even if it is connected.
If your solution to the problem is "just give up", then it's even less of a solution.
I'd be banned if I posted my solution.
Besides, I'm still voting. I'm not going to stop, because it is a helpful illustration of how little it actually can change things. 24 years straight and I still live in a shithole ruled by idiots.
It may well come to bloody revolution. But I appreciate that you're saving that as a last resort.