1075

And if something did maybe happen, it's the CIA's fault

you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
[-] Objection@lemmy.ml 8 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago)

The idea of Tiananmen Square being one of the top ten most important historical events in that time period is wild to me. Just in terms of death toll, the highest estimate mentioned on Wikipedia of 10,000 comes from a US ambassador citing an anonymous "friend," and is many times higher than any other estimate - a more realistic generous estimate is closer to 1,000 (the official number is 300). Let's compare that to the lowest estimates from the list of genocides page:

  • Gaza: 38,000 (ongoing)
  • Darfur: 98,000 (2005)
  • Congo (Effacer le tableau): 60,000 (2003)
  • Congo (Massacre of Hutis): 200,000 (1997)
  • Rwanda: 491,000 (1994)
  • Bosnia: 31,000 (1995)
  • Somalia (Isaaq): 50,000 (1989)
  • Iraq (Kurds): 50,000 (1989)
  • Cambodia: 1,386,000 (1979)
  • Indonesia (East Timor): 85,000 (1999)
  • Uganda: 100,000 (1978)

The same year that Tiananmen Square happened, two separate genocides were ongoing that, even by the most ridiculously generous comparisons possible, each killed at least 5 times as many people. Searching "Isaaq" on either .world or .ml gives exactly one hit which is a comment listing off a bunch of genocides, like I'm doing now. Entire cities were leveled and hundreds of thousands of people were forced to flee the country, but nobody ever talks about it (myself included, until today).

In addition to that list, if we're talking about events in general, then we should also look at the list of interstate wars (again, lowest estimates):

  • Persian Gulf War: 29,000 (1991)
  • War in Abkhazia: 25,000 (1993)
  • First Congo War: 235,000 (1997)
  • Kosovo War: 16,000 (1999)
  • Eritrian-Ethopian War: 53,000 (2000)
  • Second Chechen War: 20,000 (2000)

There's ongoing conflicts in Myanmar, in North Africa, in Mexico, and in Sudan, and more, each of which has left more dead than Tiananmen this year and the year's not even over yet.

So it doesn't seem especially significant in terms of raw numbers, but you could argue that it's more significant because of the effect it had on Chinese politics, as the controversy led to the resignation of the head of state, Deng Xiaoping. Except that I never ever see anything like that discussed. Either way, it didn't change the broad direction of the reforms.

I could give my own reasons as to why it's given such a high position of importance, but I'm genuinely curious to hear your own explanation of why Tiananmen would warrant a spot on a top ten list of important events, compared to any of the other events I've listed.

this post was submitted on 09 Oct 2024
1075 points (94.5% liked)

Lemmy Shitpost

27206 readers
4211 users here now

Welcome to Lemmy Shitpost. Here you can shitpost to your hearts content.

Anything and everything goes. Memes, Jokes, Vents and Banter. Though we still have to comply with lemmy.world instance rules. So behave!


Rules:

1. Be Respectful


Refrain from using harmful language pertaining to a protected characteristic: e.g. race, gender, sexuality, disability or religion.

Refrain from being argumentative when responding or commenting to posts/replies. Personal attacks are not welcome here.

...


2. No Illegal Content


Content that violates the law. Any post/comment found to be in breach of common law will be removed and given to the authorities if required.

That means:

-No promoting violence/threats against any individuals

-No CSA content or Revenge Porn

-No sharing private/personal information (Doxxing)

...


3. No Spam


Posting the same post, no matter the intent is against the rules.

-If you have posted content, please refrain from re-posting said content within this community.

-Do not spam posts with intent to harass, annoy, bully, advertise, scam or harm this community.

-No posting Scams/Advertisements/Phishing Links/IP Grabbers

-No Bots, Bots will be banned from the community.

...


4. No Porn/ExplicitContent


-Do not post explicit content. Lemmy.World is not the instance for NSFW content.

-Do not post Gore or Shock Content.

...


5. No Enciting Harassment,Brigading, Doxxing or Witch Hunts


-Do not Brigade other Communities

-No calls to action against other communities/users within Lemmy or outside of Lemmy.

-No Witch Hunts against users/communities.

-No content that harasses members within or outside of the community.

...


6. NSFW should be behind NSFW tags.


-Content that is NSFW should be behind NSFW tags.

-Content that might be distressing should be kept behind NSFW tags.

...

If you see content that is a breach of the rules, please flag and report the comment and a moderator will take action where they can.


Also check out:

Partnered Communities:

1.Memes

2.Lemmy Review

3.Mildly Infuriating

4.Lemmy Be Wholesome

5.No Stupid Questions

6.You Should Know

7.Comedy Heaven

8.Credible Defense

9.Ten Forward

10.LinuxMemes (Linux themed memes)


Reach out to

All communities included on the sidebar are to be made in compliance with the instance rules. Striker

founded 2 years ago
MODERATORS