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this post was submitted on 12 Dec 2024
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So let's imagine an individual. They go through a period of 1 or 2 years where they are in pain and suicidal. They go through all the checks and procedures that we put in place and doctors clear them for execution. They end up dead.
What if that individual were going through a slump of 2 years and afterwards they would have passed through that life phase and could have been happy and had a positive experience with life again.
How could we know? This is the issue I have. It's sort of like selling fentanyl to addicts. Yeah, it's their body their choice. Yeah, they know the risks of overdose. But they're addicted. They aren't necessarily acting rationally.
I'm not trying to tell anyone they're wrong. To be honest, I don't really know how I feel about this in general, I'm just laying out my thoughts.
For reference, I'm not trying to change your mind so much as defend my position on the matter.
To me, that's a lot of unknowns. And depending on the level of pain, physical and/or emotional, asking me to "stick it out" for a few years is a BIG ask with no guarantee at the end of it, and I would be suffering all the while. Think of it like how some people refuse chemo when diagnosed with cancer. It's a grueling process with no guarantee at the end. Some opt to not go through that preferring to make the best of the time they have left untreated.
The only one who can really know if it's worth it is the person. While it's definitely something that affects more than them (family, friends, etc), those issues, IMO, are "family meeting" issues that should be left to those affected and not the law.
Edit: On a personal note, I think I would much prefer having the option of one last adventure and then a painless, planned ending (everything wrapped up, no burdens for my family, etc) than the thought of wasting away, forgotten, in a nursing home.
A counter example that came to my mind is rabies. Look up how that progresses. There's absolutely zero chance that I would be putting myself through that if I were diagnosed with it and it was too late for the vaccine. Assisted dying just ensures that nobody has to go through the trauma of finding my body.
First off, using the word "execution" is pretty loaded. I just wanted to put that out there, especially because you're, "not trying to tell anyone they’re wrong."
Second, as of right now, MAID for mental illness on it's own is not available in Canada.
The big thing you said, but kind of glossed over is, "doctors clear them". It's not just on the individual who is making this decision, but health care professionals who use their professional opinion on the mental state of the individual. If a person is suicidal, generally a mental health care professional is involved.
Obviously, this system isn't perfect, but no system is perfect. Doctors do mess up and individuals can be influenced by their families/finances. I think these are all good reasons to be skeptical, but I also don't think they're reasons to completely prevent access.
well that's one of the things i take issue with. the ideological approach we take to this. we start using nice sound names and acronyms - euphemisms- and it can sort of hide what we are doing. the words we use matter. unrelated tangent- they've done a study in the US. you ask people whether or not they support a "death tax" and a majority will say of course not. you ask them whether they support an "inheritance tax" and all of a sudden support is flipped. do you see what I mean? the language matters.
and the fact that everyone that we are coming up with these acronyms like "MAID" (which is new to me, by the way. I've only ever heard doctor assisted suicide up until this point) i think shows that as a society we are trying to avoid some of the conversation about this. euphemisms disguise what we are really doing and they disguise what we really feel. this may be for good intentions (empathy or what have you) but road to hell is paved with good intentions
and doctors in the past have cleared the compulsory sterilization of individuals in Canada (and many other places). i have immediate family members who are doctors. some of the beliefs they hold would offend many in this thread. just because they went through medical school and trained and have above average intelligence- does not mean they will necessarily be on the right side of history.
i understand this. someone is suffering in pain in a way that life is unlivable. they are terminal so they are going to die anyway. I would not be able to deny them death if they is what they wanted. I wouldn't. So I'm not even saying we shouldn't have this policy. I just think if we do implement it, it needs to be limited to those types of cases specifically. Once we start moving into people who aren't terminal and people who are suffering from mental health exclusively, I think we would have opened a box we can't close.
i'm honest to God just trying to look into this at a deeper level. I try to be civil, I try to be empathetic with those who have suffering loved ones (I have also had suffering loved ones, in fact I have some going through something right now). I'm amazed at the level of response I've gotten to my off-hand comment. I've never gotten a fraction of the response on any lemmy comment I've written before.
I fear we are not ready as a society for this. that this may open the door for horrific consequences further down the road.