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submitted 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) by Illecors@lemmy.cafe to c/mildlyinfuriating@lemmy.world

EDIT: you guys have dug up some truly horrible pisstakes :D Thank you for those.

To the serious folk - relax a little. This is Mildly Infuriating, not I'm dying if this doesn't stop. As a non-native speaker I was taught a certain way to use the language. The rules were not written down by me, nor the teachers - it was done by the native folk. Peace!

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[-] cdf12345@lemm.ee 97 points 10 months ago
[-] livus@kbin.social 50 points 10 months ago

@cdf12345 if you really want to infuriate people that should be "I could care fewer."

[-] ITypeWithMyDick@lemmy.world 6 points 10 months ago

Bastard stole my line

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[-] Malix@sopuli.xyz 89 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago)
[malix@derp ~]$ fewer .bashrc 
bash: fewer: command not found

:(

[-] 9488fcea02a9@sh.itjust.works 16 points 10 months ago

$alias fewer = 'less'

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[-] redxef@feddit.de 29 points 10 months ago
-bash: fewer: command not found
[-] Illecors@lemmy.cafe 22 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago)
$ alias fewer=less
$ which fewer
fewer: aliased to less
[-] cloudless@feddit.uk 28 points 10 months ago

Your post is fewer than 60 minutes old.

[-] Rivalarrival@lemmy.today 14 points 10 months ago

Arguably, that is correct: "minute" is a countable noun, so should take "fewer" as a modifier.

[-] cloudless@feddit.uk 7 points 10 months ago

Yeah it is grammatically correct but most people would say "less than 5 minutes ago" or "less than 50 seconds", instead of using "fewer than".

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[-] Siethron@lemmy.world 23 points 10 months ago

I couldn't give fewer of a shit

[-] viralJ@lemmy.world 23 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago)

I'm also a non-native speaker and I've also been taught to speak a certain way ("you and I are going" but "he saw you and me"; don't split infinitives; don't end sentences with prepositions, etc.), but then I read Steven Pinker's The Language Instinct and - even more relevant here - The Sense of Style. We've been taught to use language a certain way, but our teachers were following the prescriptivist school of thought. You say these rules were written by native folk, but it's often (if not usually) the native folk that say less when they "should" be saying fewer.

I know you said it's only mildly infuriating to you, but if proper use of language is something dear to your heart (as it is to mine) - I really recommend the above books as I think this is something not worth to get even mildly infuriated about. The border between less and fewer is fuzzier than you think and - in the words of Pinker - once you really master the distinction - that's one fewer thing for you to worry about.

Edit: typo

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[-] stoy@lemmy.zip 20 points 10 months ago

I have used less several times when I should have used more...

[-] HatchetHaro@lemmy.blahaj.zone 19 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago)

when people write should of instead of should have

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[-] random9@lemmy.world 16 points 10 months ago

I've corrected people a few times on this, but then I looked it up, and from what I understand, since language is defined by usage, saying "less" when technically it should be "fewer" is still generally correct. It still sounds alright to me, though oddly the reverse (using "fewer" when it should be "less") sounds fewer (aka less) correct to me.

[-] stoly@lemmy.world 10 points 10 months ago

I’m a linguist and this is the answer. The correct usage is however people use it, not how a book editor, dictionary, or your third grade teacher think it should be used.

Example: “there’s” for both plural and singular rather than “there are” versus “there’s/there is”.

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[-] YeetPics@mander.xyz 16 points 10 months ago

Sorry, I'll do that fewer.

[-] rtxn@lemmy.world 16 points 10 months ago

Bash says that the fewer command can't be found...

[-] Illecors@lemmy.cafe 6 points 10 months ago

less is more, though!

[-] GrievingWidow420@feddit.it 13 points 10 months ago

bash: fewer: command not found

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[-] Pons_Aelius@kbin.social 13 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago)

People thinking the English language is static and has to follow rules.

This Is English, my friend. The top dog of non-proscriptive languages where meanings change over time and reflect current usage.

Want to force everyone to follow the rules?

Start speaking French.

[-] HeartyBeast@kbin.social 5 points 10 months ago

It is also a tool to allow common understanding between a diverse group of people. I’m not saying that less/fewer is an important rule. However ‘anything goes’ is going to have an impact on people’s understanding of bothe you and your message

[-] Pons_Aelius@kbin.social 6 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago)

I'm not saying anything goes either but if people around you use less and fewer interchangeably, there is no communication breakdown at all.

Do you know the correct times to use practice vs practise?

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[-] HerbalGamer@sh.itjust.works 12 points 10 months ago

So what you're saying is we need to use 'less' fewer?

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[-] Eyelessoozeguy@lemmy.world 12 points 10 months ago

I've tried more instead of less, I will have to try fewer and see how it works, which repo is fewer on?

[-] HeartyBeast@kbin.social 10 points 10 months ago

The thing I find interesting is how the mixing of less and fewer, is broadly accepted, whereas nobody tends to use ‘much’ and ‘many’ interchangeably.

I’m not quite sure why much/many is do conserved when fewer/less isn’t.

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[-] DeltaTangoLima@reddrefuge.com 10 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago)

Hmmm - maybe I should be using "fewer" less times than I should be using "less" fewer times...

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

[-] MonsiuerPatEBrown@reddthat.com 7 points 10 months ago

common usage is not the enemy

[-] themeatbridge@lemmy.world 9 points 10 months ago

Confusion is the enemy of communication. Clarity of language is critical to being understood. Correctly using "fewer" and "less" could theoretically provide context clues about what type of thing you're counting, but you will be understood irregardless of which word you choose to use.

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[-] peopleproblems@lemmy.world 6 points 10 months ago

Ok so, as a native English speaker, let me inform you, that whatever you think is a rule in English, isn't. It's a guideline. It's a hard language because we lack structure. The native teachers are teaching you the basic guidelines, not actual conversational English, which varies heavily on location, and social group.

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[-] DirigibleProtein@aussie.zone 6 points 10 months ago

Less people should be using “less” instead of “fewer”. 😜

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[-] MonkderZweite@feddit.ch 6 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago)

No link, no AUR and hard to google, thanks.

edit: the joke fell flat, because with how modern replacements often are named, fewer could easily have been a modern less.

[-] elfin8er@lemmy.world 5 points 10 months ago
[-] Illecors@lemmy.cafe 7 points 10 months ago

Well, you bastard. You're doing well!!!

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Same. It's like a tic, I'm compelled to mutter "fewer" in my mind, or else I can't keep paying attention

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this post was submitted on 19 Feb 2024
167 points (86.1% liked)

Mildly Infuriating

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