151
submitted 2 days ago by ramble81@lemm.ee to c/asklemmy@lemmy.world

Some ideas are:

  • You branch off into another timeline and your actions make no difference to the previous timeline
  • You’ve already taken said actions but just didn’t know about it so nothing changes
  • Actions taken can have an effect (so you could suddenly erase yourself if you killed your parents)
  • Only “nexus” or fixed events really matter, the timeline will sort itself out for minor changes
  • something else entirely
top 50 comments
sorted by: hot top controversial new old
[-] Appoxo@lemmy.dbzer0.com 1 points 17 hours ago

I like the idea that the timeline you exist in is that and can still be determined but everything that happened in the pasr is set in stone. Future time travel is not possible.

[-] dual_sport_dork@lemmy.world 4 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago)

From a narrative sense the "nexus" theory is certainly the most amusing, which is probably why Terry Pratchett posited it works exactly that way on numerous occasions. It turns out that history really is kings and battles and speeches and dates, and in order for history to have actually happened someone has to observe those critical events. The things in between really don't matter. History as a whole further finds a way of happening whether people are involved in it or not, and regardless of -- or possibly despite -- anyone attempting to hinder, help, or change it. The key events will always happen eventually. All anyone can do is slightly influence how long it takes for them to do so, which is why there are so many boring spans in history where it seemed like nothing really happened; That's because it didn't. Possibly until some history monk noticed, and came along to pull out whatever spanner was holding up the works.

[-] MiDaBa@lemmy.ml 8 points 1 day ago

I don't need anymore subscriptions, thank you.

[-] jaxxed@lemmy.ml 5 points 1 day ago

Time travel does exist, but you can only go forward. You just need to approach the speed of light relative to a frame of reference, and you will travel a shorter time span compared to it.

[-] LouNeko@lemmy.world 2 points 1 day ago

In either scenario, I'm more interested in where the matter you're made of will come from:

  • Either you go to the past and suddenly add additional atoms to the universe.
  • All the atoms you're made of will suddenly be taken from their origin to form you.
  • You'll be made from entirely new atoms created from pure energy meaning your arrival will cost ~6.75 Quintillion as in 10^18 Joules (I eyeballed the speed of light here so don't @ me).
[-] Teknikal@eviltoast.org 3 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago)

My belief is if you went to the past your actions would fully effect the future, no branches or anything else of course this will create paradoxes but if your a time traveller you will still exist even if you prevent your birth, if then you go back to the future there will be no record of your existence.

Hope that makes sense.

[-] tht@social.pwned.page 2 points 1 day ago

Branch off probably

[-] Buddahriffic@lemmy.world 1 points 1 day ago

Whatever it is, I don't believe paradoxes are possible (other than language ones that basically just confuse any attempts to resolve a statement or set of statements to true or false without breaking any physical laws or causality).

That said, I don't think an unstable time loop would necessarily be impossible. Eg, you go back in time and kill your grandfather before your father is conceived, which results in you never existing in the timeline, which then means no one is there to go back in time and kill your grandfather, which means the loop disappears and the timeline snaps back to the version where you do go back, and it continually alternates from there.

Not sure if any future outside of the unstable loop would exist, I think that would depend on if there's a higher dimension of time that these loops could play out over.

Or, if everything experiences the same present at the same time, it's also possible that after the first loop, it wouldn't go back to resolve the whole "killer pops out of literally nowhere" because it was in the past and no time traveler is bringing the timeline back to there, so it's all in the past. Though I think in that case, you wouldn't disappear after killing your grandfather. You'd just be an enigma that would require going outside of time to understand the origin of.

Tbh though I'm 99% sure time travel just isn't possible (paradoxes or not), just a fun thing to think about. And no, I don't consider quantum effects being symmetrical in time to be time travel, they are just cases where you can reverse cause and effect and still have a valid cause and effect sequence.

[-] sumguyonline@lemmy.world 1 points 1 day ago

Wormholes. Travel some place faster than light and see light from the past from your source of travel when you arrive, travel again back to your original spot and theoretically you travel backwards in time to before the light from the past that you just saw was even produced yet. Might work the same for just seeing the future if you glimpse through a wormhole that leads to someplace in the future by doing an Allie oop to further into the future someplace far away, then back to someplace in your future but your destinations past. Speed and gravity both impact time. A wormhole fits that description to a T.

[-] sumguyonline@lemmy.world 1 points 1 day ago

Only 1 timeline matters. You're own. Everything else becomes fluid around your timeline when you time travel.

[-] sumguyonline@lemmy.world 1 points 1 day ago

The timeline IS fragile, but the whole of existence is not in regards to time travel. If you go into the past and change it, the timeline changes, but only because the original timeline had you going back and changing it. You can see yourself. You can interact with yourself, but if everything is exactly as it should be you really don't want to go mucking around and find yourself in a world where the south lost the civil war but things are thousands of times worse and you killed the ancesotor of the inventor of time travel after breaking your machine and can no longer access the timeline to fix any issues you may have caused.

[-] pixeltree@lemmy.blahaj.zone 17 points 2 days ago

I really like the nothing is changeable and travel is possible and anything you do while traveling has already happened / was already going to happen concept

[-] lukewarm_ozone@lemmy.today 3 points 1 day ago

I wouldn't say I "like" the idea, since it's one of the most doomed ways for a universe to be, but Greg Egan's Arrows of Time is a good exploration of this idea.

[-] MehBlah@lemmy.world 17 points 2 days ago

Its a one way trip. You can never go back to the original universe.

[-] modality@lemmy.myserv.one 4 points 1 day ago

This is my biggest issue with multiverse time travel in popular culture. Somehow they always travel back and forth between 2 of Infinite timelines

[-] SwingingTheLamp@midwest.social 8 points 2 days ago

Holy existential horror, Batman! By time traveling, you've just caused an entire universe full of new alternate-timeline versions of people to pop into existence. What happened to the timeline you left? It must still exist. You couldn't have been the only consciousness that was experiencing it. To think otherwise is some extreme solipsism. Gosh, did some other time traveler create the timeline you left by entering it? For that matter, are you actually a duplicate, having just popped into existence with the memory of having time-traveled, but the timeline was created by another time traveler?

Alternatively, perhaps it's another timeline out of an infinite number of possibilities that all co-exist? Yikes! That means there's an infinity of each person across the multiverse. Therefore, you could just murder everybody within reach, and time travel back before your started the rampage. The lives in a particular timeline don't matter, there are an infinity more. I think Rick & Morty did an episode with that premise.

[-] dukeofdummies@lemmy.world 1 points 1 day ago

What happened to the timeline you left? It must still exist. You couldn’t have been the only consciousness that was experiencing it. To think otherwise is some extreme solipsism.

Why does it need to remain? It seems like solipsism to assume it must remain because it's your point of origin. If something or someone has the power to drop something into the past why wouldnt it overwrite everything? I don't see why consciousness even gets applied. The universe keeps on whether I am alive, asleep, or dead.

I see the path of time like a laser beam in a house of mirrors. If someone has the power to add a mirror somewhere. Yep, the whole beam after the fact is a vastly different pattern. Any multiverse would be entirely virtual and theoretical.

[-] SwingingTheLamp@midwest.social 1 points 1 day ago

Why does it need to remain? Because that timeline was populated by 8 billion human, and who knows how many non-human minds. I think it would be solipsism to think that only your own mind was the "real" one keeping the timeline in existence, and it collapsed because you leave it.

If the time travel power does overwrite everything, all of those minds and all of their subjective experiences are just, nothing? That's where the existential horror comes in for me.

[-] dukeofdummies@lemmy.world 2 points 1 day ago

Oh I agree, it's horrifying. And I have noooo guarantee that it's me doing the jump. Don't misunderstand I am NOT the only real mind in this example. I'm curently just hitching a ride on said laser beam. No guarantees that I will be the same or even exist if somebody so much as moves a pebble into the past from the future.

Existential dread all the way. If we get time travel I think it's as horrifying a prospect as teleportation on a universal scale with only the traveller maintaining continuity.

[-] Chaos0f7ife@lemmy.world 5 points 1 day ago

I subscribe to multiverse theory. It's probably the safest route and probably most likely.

[-] steeznson@lemmy.world 2 points 1 day ago

The current scientific theory is that time exists across space in cones that would require one to move faster than the speed of light to alter. Going to go with that one for now since I have no idea personally.

[-] SpacetimeMachine@lemmy.world 5 points 1 day ago

Light cones aren't exactly literal cones of time, they are an abstraction to help us understand the mathematics of time and space. (Assuming you are talking about Penrose diagrams.)

[-] steeznson@lemmy.world 2 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago)

Yes, it was light cones. I was half remembering the uni module I did on the philosophy of time a decade ago. We spent more time on the grandfather paradox than the actual science!

[-] spankmonkey@lemmy.world 57 points 2 days ago

You’ve already taken said actions but just didn’t know about it so nothing changes

12 Monkeys did this one perfectly.

You can't change things because if you undid the thing, then there wouldn't be a reason to undo the thing. If you go back in time, you are just going to do what you already did because that is in the past.

load more comments (17 replies)
[-] SpaceNoodle@lemmy.world 27 points 2 days ago* (last edited 2 days ago)

Whichever one is objectively correct based on empirical evidence.

Fun fact: time travel does exist, and I am myself a time traveler. The fact that I'm travelling at one second per second along with everyone else is just a minor detail.

[-] prole@lemmy.blahaj.zone 8 points 2 days ago* (last edited 2 days ago)

Imagine if someone just naturally traveled through time at like... 1.0005 seconds per second... What would that look like? Would we be able to tell? Would they be able to tell? Would their perception be different?

This is a Relativity thing, isn't it? Like the astronaut twins sort of...

[-] SpaceNoodle@lemmy.world 10 points 2 days ago

That's exactly like being a bit closer to the bottom of a steep gravity well.

Yes, we could tell if they took a precise clock with them. In fact, we have to account for an even smaller discrepancy in order for GPS to work: we here stuck further down in Earth's gravity well travel through time and extra ten milliseconds or so per year vs. an orbiting satellite.

load more comments (22 replies)
[-] Dalvoron@lemm.ee 20 points 2 days ago

I have always been a fan of stable time loops so I guess option 2 is the best one for me.

One trope I'd like to see more of is loops which are not stable themselves, but are stable as a group. Eg a 2-loop has loop A in which someone goes back in time and changes history leading to a new timeline loop B. Someone in loop B later goes back in time and changes history in a way that turns the timeline back into loop A.

My headcanon is that your option 3 is basically an n-loop that we only see the first few loops of.

load more comments (2 replies)
[-] 2ugly2live@lemmy.world 10 points 2 days ago
  • You branch off into another timeline and your actions make no difference to the previous timeline

New actions, new consequences.

[-] soupguy@lemmy.world 7 points 2 days ago

This. Time traveling is a purely selfish endeavour.

Go back and kill Hitler? Congratulations! Only you understand what changed. Doesn't help the 7 billion people you left in your original timeline.

[-] Birch@sh.itjust.works 2 points 1 day ago

But you now get to live in a cool alternate reality where the soviet union clashed directly with the allied forces as the axis never existed.

. . .

Kirov reporting.

[-] Bytemeister@lemmy.world 7 points 2 days ago* (last edited 2 days ago)

My personal favorite?

Space and time is an infinite number of parallel realities that constantly compress and unravel at every possible random chance. We are 4th (or 3.5th) dimensional beings that experience the most probable result aggregated from an infinite existence. If you time travel back in time, and change the past, it would not affect the your past, but it would affect your future, if you time traveled back to your current time.

[-] MNByChoice@midwest.social 29 points 2 days ago

I like the one where the motion of the universe is not accounted for, so the travelers drop into empty space. But someone figures out how to use that to travel through space.

Time Wars are fun though. Each prime timeline moving others toward them.

load more comments (2 replies)
[-] FaceDeer@fedia.io 16 points 2 days ago

If it actually existed, then obviously I would subscribe to whatever theory most accurately described how it worked. That's science.

If you're asking which theory I would predict is most likely, knowing only that time travel was possible as a starting point, then there are only two that I'm aware of that are logically consistent. Either:

  • Single fixed timeline, whereby if you go back in time then whatever you do there was already a part of history from the start. You won't be able to "change" anything because you were always there. This is the approach described by the Novikov self-consistency principle.

  • Multiple worlds, in which if you go back in time you just end up following a different "branch" of history forward from there.

Any of the models that let you "change your own history" are logically inconsistent and therefore utterly impossible. They just can't exist, like a square triangle or 1=2. They may be fine for entertaining movie plots but don't take them seriously.

load more comments (2 replies)
[-] untorquer@lemmy.world 15 points 2 days ago

I like the persistent present. We simply live with the paradoxes.

"Remember when Hitler was assassinated in 1919, 1933, 1936, and 1939, then off'd himself in his bunker in '45?"

load more comments (3 replies)
[-] Sasha@lemmy.blahaj.zone 13 points 2 days ago

From a quantum perspective the Deutschian and similar models are honestly pretty compelling. They essentially require matching up the past and present in a consistent way that can remove paradoxes.

These make the most sense because it's entirely possible to write down spacetimes that contain "closed time like curves" (CTCs) ie. paths connecting past and present and you can then just let physics play out on these models (or more commonly using black box quantum circuits). The only consistent way to do it is to make sure the past and future side of such curves agree. It's not my area at all, just something colleagues of mine did, but from memory there are nice approaches using the path integral formalism that work really nicely in these scenarios.

All that's to say that I don't think time travel leads to anything changing, the past will have always agreed with whatever time travel happens in the future.

Having worked very briefly with the spacetimes that produce CTCs, I don't expect we'll be able to time travel because they usually violate the weak energy condition.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quantum_mechanics_of_time_travel

load more comments
view more: next ›
this post was submitted on 02 Jan 2025
151 points (95.2% liked)

Ask Lemmy

27334 readers
2418 users here now

A Fediverse community for open-ended, thought provoking questions


Rules: (interactive)


1) Be nice and; have funDoxxing, trolling, sealioning, racism, and toxicity are not welcomed in AskLemmy. Remember what your mother said: if you can't say something nice, don't say anything at all. In addition, the site-wide Lemmy.world terms of service also apply here. Please familiarize yourself with them


2) All posts must end with a '?'This is sort of like Jeopardy. Please phrase all post titles in the form of a proper question ending with ?


3) No spamPlease do not flood the community with nonsense. Actual suspected spammers will be banned on site. No astroturfing.


4) NSFW is okay, within reasonJust remember to tag posts with either a content warning or a [NSFW] tag. Overtly sexual posts are not allowed, please direct them to either !asklemmyafterdark@lemmy.world or !asklemmynsfw@lemmynsfw.com. NSFW comments should be restricted to posts tagged [NSFW].


5) This is not a support community.
It is not a place for 'how do I?', type questions. If you have any questions regarding the site itself or would like to report a community, please direct them to Lemmy.world Support or email info@lemmy.world. For other questions check our partnered communities list, or use the search function.


6) No US Politics.
Please don't post about current US Politics. If you need to do this, try !politicaldiscussion@lemmy.world or !askusa@discuss.online


Reminder: The terms of service apply here too.

Partnered Communities:

Tech Support

No Stupid Questions

You Should Know

Reddit

Jokes

Ask Ouija


Logo design credit goes to: tubbadu


founded 2 years ago
MODERATORS