552
you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
view the rest of the comments
this post was submitted on 23 Dec 2024
552 points (98.8% liked)
politics
19239 readers
1873 users here now
Welcome to the discussion of US Politics!
Rules:
- Post only links to articles, Title must fairly describe link contents. If your title differs from the site’s, it should only be to add context or be more descriptive. Do not post entire articles in the body or in the comments.
Links must be to the original source, not an aggregator like Google Amp, MSN, or Yahoo.
Example:
- Articles must be relevant to politics. Links must be to quality and original content. Articles should be worth reading. Clickbait, stub articles, and rehosted or stolen content are not allowed. Check your source for Reliability and Bias here.
- Be civil, No violations of TOS. It’s OK to say the subject of an article is behaving like a (pejorative, pejorative). It’s NOT OK to say another USER is (pejorative). Strong language is fine, just not directed at other members. Engage in good-faith and with respect! This includes accusing another user of being a bot or paid actor. Trolling is uncivil and is grounds for removal and/or a community ban.
- No memes, trolling, or low-effort comments. Reposts, misinformation, off-topic, trolling, or offensive. Similarly, if you see posts along these lines, do not engage. Report them, block them, and live a happier life than they do. We see too many slapfights that boil down to "Mom! He's bugging me!" and "I'm not touching you!" Going forward, slapfights will result in removed comments and temp bans to cool off.
- Vote based on comment quality, not agreement. This community aims to foster discussion; please reward people for putting effort into articulating their viewpoint, even if you disagree with it.
- No hate speech, slurs, celebrating death, advocating violence, or abusive language. This will result in a ban. Usernames containing racist, or inappropriate slurs will be banned without warning
We ask that the users report any comment or post that violate the rules, to use critical thinking when reading, posting or commenting. Users that post off-topic spam, advocate violence, have multiple comments or posts removed, weaponize reports or violate the code of conduct will be banned.
All posts and comments will be reviewed on a case-by-case basis. This means that some content that violates the rules may be allowed, while other content that does not violate the rules may be removed. The moderators retain the right to remove any content and ban users.
That's all the rules!
Civic Links
• Congressional Awards Program
• Library of Congress Legislative Resources
• U.S. House of Representatives
Partnered Communities:
• News
founded 2 years ago
MODERATORS
Lock the child rapist up.
Why is this even an argument? Republicans are disgusting sickos, letting this piece of shit roam around, actively protecting him.
I mean, he paid minors to cross state lines for sex...
That's a federal thing and Biden's AG could bring charges.
We have another month before Republicans are the only ones who can hold him accountable. But I'm not expecting much, even tho child trafficking should be an obvious charge and evidence already uncovered.
I just don't think Biden's admin has it in them to do anything about this. They'll ignore it and then later complain when Republicans do the same thing.
Neither party is really interested in politicians ever being held accountable, if not, Biden would have done something about trump in the last four years.
They could have charged him any time in the last several years. Don't hold your breath.
Really going to both-sides this? Merrick Garland is a heel-dragging clown, but even if Biden replaced him with the most aggressive and seasoned prosecutor on Earth today, how the absolute fucking fuck would you expect them to try this case in 28 days?
That is a federal thing, and Biden could bring federal charges; good job, cookie for you. What would he be doing by bringing these? Oh, just casually getting him indicted and either not having enough time to start the trial or, if the trial does somehow start, creating jeopardy and thereby disallowing future prosecution when Trump inevitably drops the case. Good thinking. Too bad you're not running the country with this 5D political calculus.
Edit: so actually, there's technically no risk of double jeopardy, because what the OP is describing is completely impossible anyway:
"Unless the defendant consents in writing to the contrary, the trial shall not commence less than thirty days from the date on which the defendant first appears through counsel or expressly waives counsel and elects to proceed pro se."
Thus you'll never reach a jury being impaneled or a witness being sworn, because the trial will never happen. So bravo, I guess; that risk isn't there. What you have instead is a DOA case that simply goes absolutely nowhere.
And Biden appointed him after Trump tried to steal an election...
Do you think Biden is stupid and thought Merrick wouldnt be a "heel dragging clown"? Or do you think he knew and that's why he was picked?
Is Biden incompetent or intentionally maintaining the status quo where the rich and politically connected are above the law?
Like...
Is this the first time you noticed Merrick was a waste of a pick? Do you think up until now he's been doing a fine job?
You're completely ignoring the point of my comment. To answer your side-stepping question, I suspected Garland would be a heel-dragging clown the second Biden appointed him. Now back to our regularly scheduled program: you seem to be implying that the DoJ should prosecute Gaetz because they can. What exactly does that accomplish except to risk double jeopardy? Because I know you know this can't be tried in 28 days, and it could barely even be brought to trial in 28 days.
Double jeopardy doesn't prevent state and federal charges for the same crime...
So unless you think Trump's DOJ will prosecute them, I don't understand why you're talking about double jeopardy. I mean, you seem to think Biden has to charge and finish?
Like, you have some basic misunderstandings about our legal system (and other stuff) but you're very opinionated about this and openly antagonistic to people trying to assist you...
I'm not going to explain basic legal concepts while you try to have a slap fight over God knows what.
You're correct that double jeopardy applies separately to state and federal charges. Literally nobody in this thread was disputing that; this is a strawman.
Yes. For a successful federal prosecution started under this term, Biden has to charge and finish. Else you risk double jeopardy at the federal level while accomplishing absolutely nothing. Are you seriously suggesting that the DoJ assemble a case and attempt to bring it to trial in 28 days, then when that does fuck-all, hand this case off to a state AG which would presumably be Florida? You've still refused to answer what possible benefit Biden's DoJ charging Gaetz at the federal level today confers, which tells me that your answer is "I have no good answer and I've backed myself into a corner, so I'm going to refuse to say that and double down instead."
You think all federal charges just disappear every time there is a new administration?
Do you think that sentence constitutes an argument or even a complete thought?
Do you think we should abandon even attempting to follow the rule of (moral) law just because we know a certain piece of shit often ignores it? I think you have to do the right thing regardless as long as it's in your power.
No one said that and I'm not sure where you got the idea
No, I'm not actually suggesting the ridiculous strawman you've just constructed. Of course plenty of prosecutions have continued through more than one administration. That said...
Holy fucking shit, are you actually suggesting that Trump wouldn't direct his corrupt-ass DoJ to immediately drop the case against Gaetz? Is that actually how far in denial the "Um, actually, just charge him lol" camp is now? That they think if Biden charges him now, Trump will see to completion the federal prosecution of one of his cronies who he tried to nominate as the head of the DoJ? That's the argument you're running with? If so, then I'm done here, because that's a delusion well beyond anything that's worth anyone's time.
givesomefucks really cares about one thing and that's raging toward Democrats. That's all.
And weirdly, he has a fan club, apparently. I find it appalling that people upvote him and jump in to assist his "arguments"
We've known about Gaetz' child sex trafficking ring for about 18 months now.
Lol the people arguing about "evidence" and "investigations" are completely missing the real point, IMO.
If you or I were up on these charges, investigation, trial, and sentencing would be carried out in less than a month without hesitation or issue as far as the government is concerned.
The ONLY reason it's taking longer than that is because of who it is.
Full stop.
What you're describing is literally impossible under federal law.
Edit: For those downvoting without reading the link, here's why you're completely, categorically wrong:
"Unless the defendant consents in writing to the contrary, the trial shall not commence less than thirty days from the date on which the defendant first appears through counsel or expressly waives counsel and elects to proceed pro se."
Biden has 28 days, so this is moot in that case, but we'll run with "a month" to mean "31 days". We'll also assume we're in fairytale land where pretrial discovery for a case involving several different federal crimes over a period of 4 to 7 years ago can find all relevant evidence and witnesses within a span of 30 days, that the defendant opts for a bench trial instead of a jury and the prosecution agrees, that all of the witnesses can miraculously be scheduled on the same arbitrary day, and that the defense can't successfully petition to delay the trial (30 days is extremely hasty for this sort of thing, so they probably could in the real world), then @SARGE@startrek.website still needs to explain how, in the span of one day, the trial is supposed to have opening statements, presentation of witnesses and evidence, direct and cross-examination of witnesses, closing arguments, the judge's deliberation, and somehow sentencing??? in the span of a single day.
Just dropping in here to say once again: it's fucking absurd you're getting downvoted while the fraudulent dipshit is getting upvotes. This is a large reason Democrats lose. People who pretend to be leftist are actively helping Republicans win the propaganda war.
Initial reports, and rock-solid evidence to bring to court to try an elected sitting congressman are two VERY different things. 18 months is rarely enough time to do discovery and complete a trial for a murder with multiple eye-witnesses.
Hell, the Parkland Shooting, where he admitted to doing it and pleaded guilty took over 3 YEARS to come to conclusion. Gaetz would have been fighting tooth and nail to ride it out to the next administration who would promptly try to drop the case.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parkland_high_school_shooting
We literally saw the venmo transaction lol
I've seen people charged, tried, and prosecuted for soliciting sex in a weekend.
How odd! The courts operate on the weekends where you live? Go to jail around here on a Friday and you're sitting until Monday, at least.
Are we just making shit up now?! FFS, the report is out and plenty fucking damning.
Not at all! Him and a friend were arranging minors traveling over state lines for sex.
That's called child sex trafficking.
Point to the relevant paragraph in the exhaustive report that was released.
https://d3i6fh83elv35t.cloudfront.net/static/2024/12/Committee-Report.pdf
It was released 18 months ago, when this all broke.
A witness, the public financial transaction, and his location was confirmed via multiple sources.
Yup. Biden and Garland are still shit. If you think I'm excusing their overall conduct, you're wrong, although I do at least agree with some of the points that a9 makes above which temper my criticism. What I'm calling out specifically is the OP's asinine idea to federally prosecute Gaetz at the 11th hour. They've (correctly) pointed out in order to defeat a strawman they constructed that double jeopardy is distinct between state and federal prosecution. What they've failed to point out, however, is that federal double jeopardy is catastrophic for the case because the jurisdiction which would have the authority to prosecute otherwise is the state of Florida. At this point, the damage from Biden's and Garland's decision not to prosecute is done and dusted; their idea makes no sense and only makes things worse. It's like accusing a surgeon of waiting too long to operate (a potentially fair criticsm) and telling them that therefore the best option is to open up the patient and leave them on the table to die.
This was all well known years ago. Waiting on a congressional report was always a cop out.
The report specifically says he did not. One minor and he didn't move her across state lines. However, 17 is statutory rape in Florida.
Paying a minor for sex alone is a violation of the Federal sex trafficking statute, no transportation across state lines required.
Wtf does this have to do with anyone besides the FBI?
Because the FBI can only bring charges to the office of the attorney general. And the AG are divided into regions that do not map to the political maps of the states.
And the AG has more people to please than just the FBI. And the FBI, right now, is under pressure to submit to the incoming Trump presidency.